August 2020 - tz - lists.iana.org

Re: [tz] Change Request: Europe/Kiev to Europe/Kyiv
by John Hawkinson 18 Mar '22

18 Mar '22

I do not think we have handled this well; we have not given Victor Perov a good answer. Indeed, to some extent we've made it a "runaround." We can do better. We should take the time to write up a good lengthy explanation of the issues ("boilerplate"), because this a really important issue of concern to many people in the world and the project has indeed thought about it pretty carefully. Dismissing the inquiries because they are repetitive makes it seem like we haven't, and that unnecessarily upsets peopl. Victor Perev: I don't have time for a full write-up right now, but please consult the archives of the tz list (http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/ or perhaps https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amm.icann.org%2Fpipermail%2Ftz%2F+kyiv which returns 203 results). The tz project is very conservative in its judgment for when the predominant English spelling of a city has changed, and so far the project has judged that Kiev is still preferred. We discussed it when major English newspapers and style guides changed from Kiev to Kyiv last year (prompted by the US presidential impeachment, which lead to a lot of discussion about Kyiv in America), and we will probably continue to discuss it as time goes on. But we've thought about it and discussed it a lot. The answers you got don't explain that, and that means we have not done a good a job as we should have. Sorry about that. In particular, I think Brian Inglis's answer was actually incorrect in a way that really matters ("Kiev is the correct English spelling"). There are multiple correct English spellings. It used to be that Kiev was the only one, but Kyiv is gaining popularity more and more. Paul Eggert <eggert(a)cs.ucla.edu> wrote on Sat, 15 Aug 2020 at 18:19:08 EDT in <cefc7f01-a3e9-f2a4-9ab9-5288147f994a(a)cs.ucla.edu>: > Thanks for bringing that to the mailing list (if I could shut off GitHub > pull requests I would). Although you cannot do so, we can handle them a little bit better. Please see https://docs.github.com/en/github/building-a-strong-community/creating-a-pu… You can create a template that explains to a would-be pull request submitter than pull requests will be closed and the project uses the mailing list for development discussions. ("I understand that the tz project does not use pull requests on github, and that if I enter a pull request here, it will be closed and I will be directed to send email to tz(a)iana.org.") For the particular case of regular, recurring issues, it may be worth while to keep one of #15, #26, and #27 open and mark the others as a duplicate of it, so that it is easier for newcomers to understand that this issue has been carefully considered and is not a simple oversight. https://github.com/eggert/tz/pulls?q=kiev Also, not to pick on Brian (again), but if the project policy is not to use github pull requests, it's not great to respond to pull requests on their substance, because it bifurcates the discussion and makes it seem like we actually do use pull requests ("except when we don't"). So what seems like a helpful thing may not be. -- jhawk(a)alum.mit.edu John Hawkinson

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Italy April 1944 discrepancy between comment and data
by Alois Treindl 05 Oct '21

05 Oct '21

For Italy in 1944 zone Europe/Rome there is a discrepancy between the comment and the data. comment: # From Paul Eggert (2016-10-27): # Go with INRiM for DST rules, except as corrected by Inglis for 1944 # for the Kingdom of Italy. This is consistent with Renzo Baldini. # Model Rome's occupation by using C-Eur rules from 1943-09-10 # to 1944-06-04; although Rome was an open city during this period, it # was effectively controlled by Germany. Data for Italy is Rule Italy 1944 only - Apr 2 2:00s 1:00 S Data for C-Eur is: Rule C-Eur 1944 1945 - Apr Mon>=1 2:00s 1:00 S where Mon>=1 in 1944 is April 3. So Rome is NOT following C-Eur. I think the rule for Itay is right, only the comment is misleading.

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FW: [Ext] The TZ Coordination
by Naela Sarras 02 Apr '21

02 Apr '21

Dear Paul, Please see the note below from our colleagues in Morocco regarding the upcoming timezone change for Morocco. Best regards, Naela Naela Sarras Director, IANA Operations ICANN From: EL MAAYATI Afaf <afaf(a)anrt.ma> Date: Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 12:01 PM To: Naela Sarras <naela.sarras(a)iana.org> Cc: BENLEMLIH Hamida <benlemlih(a)anrt.ma> Subject: [Ext] The TZ Coordination Dear Naela, I hope this email finds you well, safe and healthy. Actually, I have a request concerning the configuration of the Time-Zone for Morocco. In the Database file: ftp://ftp.iana.org/tz/tzdb-2020a/africa, it’s mentionned that a program will be running to implement the transition dates: [cid:image001.jpg@01D6342E.01C70B10] Currently we are implementing GMT and we will move to GMT+1 next Sunday, May 31. So, if possible, would you please help to get in touch with Mr. Paul Eggert, in order to have the procedure to notify IANA officially, from a governmental source, with the changes of TZ in Morocco. Thank you in advance for your feedback and for your habitual support. Best Regards, Afaf ________________________________ Ce message, son contenu et toutes les pièces jointes sont adressés à l'attention exclusive de leur (s) destinataire (s) et sont strictement confidentiels : ils relèvent de la correspondance privée. Toute publication, utilisation ou diffusion, même partielle, par des personnes autres que les destinataires est interdite et doit être autorisée par l'Agence Nationale de Règlementation des Télécommunications (ANRT, Royaume du Maroc). Si vous recevez ce message par erreur, nous vous prions de le détruire après en avoir informé son expéditeur sans délai. L’ANRT décline toute responsabilité pour toute altération, déformation ou falsification subi par le message et ses pièces jointes au cours de leur transmission. Retrouvez toutes les informations de l’ANRT sur son site Web à l’adresse suivante : http://www.anrt.ma. ________________________________ This message, its content and its attachments are intended for the exclusive use of the named addressee (s) and are strictly confidential. Any copy or other use of this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited and should be authorized by the National Agency of Telecommunications Regulation (ANRT, Morocco). If you have received this communication in error, please delete the material and notify the sender. The ANRT accepts no liability for any alteration, distortion or falsification that may occur during the transmission of this message. All information about ANRT can be found on our website at the following address http://www.anrt.ma. ________________________________ إن هذه الرسالة ومحتواها ومرفقاتها موجهة خصيصا للشخص المرسل إليه وتعتبر سرية وتصنف ضمن خانة المراسلات ذات طبيعة شخصية. ويمنع منعا كليا نشر أو استعمال أو بث، ولو بطريقة جزئية، لهذه الرسالة من طرف أشخاص غير المرسل إليهم ما لم يتم الترخيص بذلك من طرف الوكالة الوطنية لتقنين المواصلات (المملكة المغربية. في حالة ما إذا توصلتم هذه الرسالة عن طريق الخطأ، يرجى منكم العمل على إتلافها فورا بعد إخبار الشخص المرسل إليه بذلك. ولا تتحمل الوكالة الوطنية لتقنين المواصلات أي مسؤولية عن أي تحريف أو تغيير أو تزييف قد يلحق بمحتوى الرسالة أو بمرفقاتها خلال عملية الإرسال. للمزيد من المعلومات، يرجى الاطلاع على الموقع الإلكتروني للوكالة الوطنية لتقنين المواصلات : http://www.anrt.ma.

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DST changes in Hungary (full historical revision)
by Nyáry Géza 12 Oct '20

12 Oct '20

Dear Paul! I examined it all of the Hungary daylight saving time changes. More differences I found what I repaired and I prepared it it source file, which I attach to this letter. I used Library Hungarica online database as a source, where from scanned contemporary ministerial decrees, instructions, newspapers and from other documents it was possible to find the time of the changes concerning the years. https://library.hungaricana.hu I checked the modified changes many times and I considered it right. If it's possible, I ask the exchange the attached modified Hungarian section in global database! Thank you very much! Bets regards, Géza Nyáry

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Removing systemv, pacificnew, Rule TYPEs, zic -y
by Tim Parenti 04 Oct '20

04 Oct '20

I noticed recently that the systemv file, which adapted a subset of North American zones with limited rulesets to old versions of System V, has had all its once-useful bits commented out since 2005p. Looking back at list archives, even discussion at the time argued that the file wasn't really needed then. The attached proposed patch 0001 removes this obsolete file and its references. Of course, I was only looking at systemv in the first place because I'd also recalled that we're still distributing the pacificnew file, which has caused some confusion every so often and has likewise generally outlived its usefulness. This led me to the related file yearistype.sh, which is also unused, except as a default script to pass to the Makefile to process the TYPE field of Rule lines. Given that the TYPE field hasn't been used by tzdata since 2000f and has been more formally deprecated since 2015f, the whole unused feature is ripe for "spring cleaning". The attached proposed patch 0002 completely drops support for the TYPE field (marking it reserved for compatibility purposes) and causes non-trivial use of the field or use of zic's -y option to error (instead of warning as it has since 2017c). It also removes the pacificnew and yearistype.sh files that are no longer needed and updates documentation accordingly. I don't presently foresee any need to repurpose the nullified field down the road, but this is the next step in allowing us to "reclaim" it in the event that such a need should arise in the future. -- Tim Parenti

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Updating zic.c to further match Link line field names
by Tim Parenti 03 Oct '20

03 Oct '20

In working on my latest proposed patch, I also noticed an outdated error message in zic.c which referred to the FROM field of a Link line. We had updated these field names in comments and documentation in release 2014g to be more descriptive and readily understandable like the parameters of 'ln': https://github.com/eggert/tz/commit/78e3924ea43079a0f3333677a728e0f0ed679cd3 The attached proposed patch further updates the zic.c code to more consistently use these new names throughout. This mostly affects the naming of parameters and locals, but a few macros and struct fields are also updated for consistency. -- Tim Parenti

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Re: [tz] [IANA #1173666] Time zone change - Yukon Canada
by Andrew.Smith＠gov.yk.ca 30 Sep '20

30 Sep '20

Good day. I work for the Government of Yukon in Canada. We are in the process of revising our definition of time to be permanently on UTC -7, no longer observing a twice-annual time change. I was on the hunt for authoritative standards related to time, and saw the IANA come up as caretaker of the time zone database, which appears to be relied on for software and systems. I am contacting you to see if there is any process beyond notification to making this adjustment in your TZ database, and perhaps to know if there are other agencies that should be aware of what Yukon is planning. From what I see now, TZ database names "America/Dawson", "America/Whitehorse" and "Canada/Yukon" would be affected by this change. Our regulation is not yet complete, so it is not law at this time and I am not looking for immediate change. We are aiming for finalization here by November 1, 2020. Hope to hear from you soon. Andrew Andrew G. Smith Intergovernmental Relations Executive Council Office Government of Yukon C: 867-335-6008 -----Original Message----- From: Amanda Baber via RT <iana-questions(a)iana.org> Sent: July 2, 2020 3:48 PM To: Andrew.Smith <Andrew.Smith(a)gov.yk.ca> Subject: [IANA #1173666] Time zone change - Yukon Canada Dear Andrew, Thank you for contacting us. IANA hosts the Time Zone Database, but the database is managed by the Time Zone Coordinator in conjunction with a mailing list. You can find find mailing list information here: https://www.iana.org/time-zones This document should have or point to much of the information you're looking for: https://data.iana.org/time-zones/tz-link.html As is noted at the link above, "If your government plans to change its time zone boundaries or daylight saving rules, inform tz(a)iana.org well in advance, as this will coordinate updates to many cell phones, computers, and other devices around the world. With less than a year's notice there is a good chance that some computer-based clocks will operate incorrectly after the change, due to delays in propagating updates to software and data. The shorter the notice, the more likely clock problems will arise; see https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=https%3a%… for examples." Best regards, Amanda Baber Lead IANA Services Specialist On Thu Jul 02 22:20:44 2020, Andrew.Smith(a)gov.yk.ca wrote: > Good day. > > I work for the Government of Yukon in Canada. We are in the process of > revising our definition of time to be permanently on UTC -7, no longer > observing a twice-annual time change. > I was on the hunt for authoritative standards related to time, and saw > the IANA come up as caretaker of the time zone database, which appears > to be relied on for software and systems. I started with ISO 8601, but > couldn't see the full text to know if there are time zone standards > there. I am contacting you to see your TZ database is a widely adopted > and authoritative as it seems, to see if there is any process to > making this adjustment in your TZ database, and perhaps to know if > there are other agencies that should be aware of what Yukon is > planning. > From what I see now, TZ database names "America/Dawson", > "America/Whitehorse" and "Canada/Yukon" would be affected by this > change. > > Our regulation is not yet complete, so it is not law at this time and > I am not looking for immediate change. We are aiming for finalization > here by November 1, 2020. > Hope to hear from you soon. > > Andrew > > > [cid:image003.png@01D65084.40C16690] > > Andrew G. Smith > Intergovernmental Relations > Executive Council Office > C 867-335-6008 | Yukon.ca

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timezone DB distribution
by Juergen Naeckel 08 Sep '20

08 Sep '20

Hey there, First of all, I would like to thank you. I have to implement something in JavaScript that uses timezones. However, I am using an older JS version that does not have the flexibility like today’s JS. So I was looking for a repository holding all current timezones and rules for it, rather then me, checking time and again how which timezone is configured 😉 This really could help me. Reading through the files, it sometimes made me chuckle and I was actually surprised how fluent timezones are handled. Changes almost every year… I would like to recommend some improvements. I know you have pretty stable release by now. I am aware that changes probably to the structure might affect a lot of people/projects. However… First of all, a tar.gz is Linux specific. True, you could install additional Windows software. But, that might not go well with customers of mine. I think a ZIP would be acceptable for both worlds. Since I was interested in the repository, I downloaded the “Data only distribution”. I found six files containing the TZ information. And I found 27 files, containing other stuff. Well, there might be three or four files in a grey zone (calendars, backlist…). But I definitely do not consider MAKEFILE and .awk file as part of a “data only distribution”. Maybe move them to a separate folder in the GZ file? Finally, I got one more recommendation/question. I had read the readme file but it didn’t explain the data I saw in the files. It took me a while to understand the concept of the data structure. Some info of what to see in the file, and how to read it would help. And I think the first line of the ZONE definition contains some inconsistency (maybe I still didn’t understand it correctly). Below is a screenshot. See the first line for the zones? It looks mismatched with the New York. The RULE and the [UNTIL] are probably in the wrong column. Format is probably missing. [cid:image002.png@01D674A5.27F71B60] Then I noticed that the open-end validity. For rules it is denoted as “max” and for zones it is just a <blank>. Could we get some consistency here? And finally here comes my question: In the rules, I see in the column several times denoted with a tailing “u” or “s”. I think I read on one occasion that the times are denoted in “standard time”. I do not recall anymore where that was. But regardless, 1. I don’t understand what that “denoted in standard time” would mean 2. I definitely have no clue would the tailing “u”: would imply. [cid:image003.png@01D674A6.99550F50] Can you shed some light on this? Thank you! Not only for an answer but also for researching and compiling this list. Juergen Juergen Naeckel PRINCIPAL ARCHITECT T 617 766 2381 | C 617 775 3874 naeckel(a)adobe.com [cid:image001.png@01D6749A.D7B33580]

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DST in the news
by Arthur David Olson 29 Aug '20

29 Aug '20

"American Academy of Sleep Medicine calls for elimination of daylight saving time" https://aasm.org/american-academy-of-sleep-medicine-calls-for-elimination-o… (Use your browser's vertical scroll bar to move through the article while avoiding an obscuring popup.) Noted on @Twitter by @AASMorg and retweeted by Jef Poskanzer (@JefPosk): https://twitter.com/AASMorg/status/1299334700478201858 @dash dashado

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[PROPOSED] * asia: Cite Barak 2020 on Israeli DST controversy.
by Paul Eggert 23 Aug '20

23 Aug '20

--- asia | 4 ++++ 1 file changed, 4 insertions(+) diff --git a/asia b/asia index 106efad..fff9a10 100644 --- a/asia +++ b/asia @@ -1699,6 +1699,10 @@ Zone Asia/Baghdad 2:57:40 - LMT 1890 # Israel +# For more info about the motivation for DST in Israel, see: +# Barak Y. Israel's Daylight Saving Time controversy. Israel Affairs. +# 2020-08-11. https://doi.org/10.1080/13537121.2020.1806564 + # From Ephraim Silverberg (2001-01-11): # # I coined "IST/IDT" circa 1988. Until then there were three -- 2.25.4

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