October 1992 - tz - lists.iana.org

East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan [forwarded with permission]
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

> From: henry(a)zoo.toronto.edu > Date: Wed, 28 Oct 92 11:58:53 EST > Subject: Re: East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan > To: ado(a)elsie.nci.nih.gov, eggert(a)twinsun.com > Cc: jones(a)skorpio.usask.ca (W. Jones), peachey(a)pixar.com > > >... Anyway, I agree with Darwyn that the situation since around the > >Unix epoch is CST year round for the whole province, not just some flakes > >in the eastern corner. > > Actually, I think the province *is* split, but it's not an eastern corner > vs. everybody else. I grew up in Saskatoon, which is roughly central (and > one of the two major cities), and as a kid (1960s) I never knew DST *existed*. > (DST still strikes me as strange and stupid, actually.) Saskatoon, and at > least the immediate vicinity, has been on CST year round for a long time. > > On the other hand, other areas of the province haven't been... I first > became aware of DST when visiting relatives in Fort Qu'Appelle, a small > town south and east of Saskatoon. That was mid-late 1960s. I haven't been > back there for a long time and don't know the current situation. > > Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology > henry(a)zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry

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East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan [forwarded with permission]
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

> Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 15:40:24 PST > From: eggert(a)twinsun.com (Paul Eggert) > Message-Id: <9210272340.AA13750(a)farside.twinsun.com> > To: ado(a)elsie.nci.nih.gov > ... > Subject: East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan > ... > W. Jones works in Saskatoon, which (according to my dictionary) is in Central > Saskatchewan. Assuming he's correct about the clocks in his immediate > neighborhood, at least the `East-' in `East-Saskatchewan' must be wrong. > Of your sources, Bur and Peachey (another Saskatchewan resident) agree with > Jones, whereas Devine disagrees. Given the current evidence, I'd tend to go > with Bur, Jones, and Peachey -- after all, two of them live there.

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Historical material on Saskatchewan
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

I've attached some historical material on the original of East-Sask. --ado > From seismo!mit-eddie!spock.ee.mcgill!mannix.decnet!burj Fri Mar 6 08:58:05 1987 > Received: by elsie.UUCP (5.51/4.7) > id AA13319; Fri, 6 Mar 87 08:57:48 EST > Received: by seismo.CSS.GOV (5.54/1.14) > id AA12469; Fri, 6 Mar 87 05:13:00 EST > Received: by harvard.harvard.edu; Fri, 6 Mar 87 05:13:14 EST > Received: by EDDIE.MIT.EDU (5.31/4.7) id AA25906; Fri, 6 Mar 87 05:12:12 EST > Received: from spock by musocs.cs.mcgill id aa00376; 6 Mar 87 4:40 EST > Received: from Mannix.UdeM (mannix.ARPA) by spock.EE.MCGILL (4.12) > id AA00684; Fri, 6 Mar 87 04:50:05 est > Date: Thu, 5 Mar 87 03:37:17 est > From: Justin Bur <seismo!harvard!spock.ee.mcgill!mannix.decnet!burj> > Message-Id: <8703050837.AA00977(a)Mannix.UdeM> > Poslfit: poslfit > To: musocs!tz%elsie.uucp > Subject: DST in Saskatchewan, Canada > > The province of Saskatchewan, normally in the Central time zone, > has not used daylight savings time for the past several years. > I think there was some talk of using it for the first time this > year, but I don't remember. I also don't know if DST has never > been used in Sask. or if it used to be used some time ago: my > source is the national radio schedules of the Canadian Broadcasting > Corporation, and my subscription started in 198?. I will send more > precise information if I can find it, but it would probably be best > to find a local source of information. I *think* sask.uucp is the > University of Saskatchewan; I don't have a uucp map handy. > > Justin Bur -- Universite de Montreal > <burj(a)iros1.uucp> seismo!think!mosart!mcgill-vision!iros1!burj > > From seismo!ihnp4!sask!skorpio.UUCP!peachey Mon Mar 16 21:59:53 1987 > Received: by elsie.UUCP (5.51/4.7) > id AA00162; Mon, 16 Mar 87 21:59:38 EST > Received: from cbosgd.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV (5.54/1.14) with UUCP > id AA13632; Mon, 16 Mar 87 17:31:56 EST > Received: by cbosgd.MIS.OH.ATT.COM (smail2.2) > id AA07856; 16 Mar 87 17:31:04 EST (Mon) > Received: by ihnp4.ATT.COM id AA03508; 16 Mar 87 15:10:26 CST (Mon) > Received: by sask.USask.UUCP (4.12/USask-2.01/9-Feb-87) > id AA24861; Mon, 16 Mar 87 15:03:37 cst > Received: by skorpio.USask.UUCP (4.12/USask-2.0/17-Dec-86) > id AA02480; Mon, 16 Mar 87 14:54:46 cst > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 87 14:54:46 cst > From: seismo!ihnp4!skorpio!peachey (Darwyn Peachey) > Message-Id: <8703162054.AA02480(a)skorpio.USask.UUCP> > To: elsie!tz > Subject: northamerica timezones & Saskatchewan > Cc: peachey > > > If I am reading your "northamerica" (version 3.1) timezone file correctly, > it appears to be inaccurate concerning the province of Saskatchewan in > Canada. You seem to assume that all of Canada observes the DST rules. > In fact, Saskatchewan is always on standard time and has been for several > years (up to 20, I'd guess). To be more precise, we are always on daylight > time, since we are geographically in the Mountain zone, but we use Central > Standard Time year round! Thus, there is always a four hour time difference > between us and Hawaii (whereas the temperature difference varies from > -130F to +20F). > > Darwyn Peachey peachey(a)sask.UUCP peacheyd(a)sask.BITNET (306) 966-4909 > > From seismo!nbires!vianet!devine Tue Mar 17 14:33:32 1987 > Received: by elsie.UUCP (5.51/4.7) > id AA03816; Tue, 17 Mar 87 14:33:18 EST > From: seismo!nbires!vianet!devine > Received: from nbires.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV (5.54/1.14) with UUCP > id AA14658; Tue, 17 Mar 87 12:36:49 EST > Date: Tue, 17 Mar 87 12:36:49 EST > Message-Id: <8703171736.AA14658(a)seismo.CSS.GOV> > To: elsie!tz > Subject: Re: northamerica timezones & Saskatchewan > Cc: devine > > Darwyn Peachey peachey(a)sask.UUCP writes: > > If I am reading your "northamerica" (version 3.1) timezone file correctly, > > it appears to be inaccurate concerning the province of Saskatchewan in > > Canada. You seem to assume that all of Canada observes the DST rules. > > In fact, Saskatchewan is always on standard time and has been for several > > years (up to 20, I'd guess). To be more precise, we are always on daylight > > time, since we are geographically in the Mountain zone, but we use Central > > Standard Time year round! > > The information I have found on Saskatchewan Daylight Time is this: > > 1962-1971 Variable (each locality may have done something different) > but it seems to be last Sunday in April to last Sunday > in October (September in 1960-1) > > 1972-present? Observed in entire province except in the far-eastern > part (that part is on Central Standard time all year) > The western part is on the last Sunday in April to > last Sunday in October schedule > > I don't know where the machine 'skorpio' is but I infer that it is in > the Eastern part of Saskatchewan. Does anyone have access to an official > publication of Canada that describes DST? Does such a publication exist? > > Bob Devine

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East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan [forwarded with permission]
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

> Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 13:38:07 PST > From: eggert(a)twinsun.com (Paul Eggert) > Message-Id: <9210272138.AA13450(a)farside.twinsun.com> > To: ado(a)ncifcrf.gov > Subject: East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan [slightly revised patch] > > Here's a slightly revised patch for the East-Saskatchewan problem. The only > change to the previous patch is the last one -- the change to Mexico/General. > This version thus saves a bit of disk space, since Canada/Saskatchewan and > Mexico/General are identical. > > *** northamerica Thu Apr 23 10:34:33 1992 > --- northamerica.fix Tue Oct 27 13:32:04 1992 > *************** > *** 215,220 **** > --- 215,224 ---- > # be same as Pacific. Stick with rules posted in 1988 until more authoritative > # information is available. > > + # From W. Jones (October 27, 1992): > + # Since (I believe) around 1964, all of Saskatchewan is on CST year round, > + # by law [the U.S. Naval Observatory notwithstanding]. > + > # Rule NAME FROM TO TYPE IN ON AT SAVE LETTER/S > Rule Canada 1969 max - Oct lastSun 2:00 0 S > Rule Canada 1969 1986 - Apr lastSun 2:00 1:00 D > *************** > *** 226,232 **** > Zone Canada/Atlantic -4:00 Canada A%sT > Zone Canada/Eastern -5:00 Canada E%sT > Zone Canada/Central -6:00 Canada C%sT > ! Zone Canada/East-Saskatchewan -6:00 - CST # No DST as of 1987 > Zone Canada/Mountain -7:00 Canada M%sT > Zone Canada/Pacific -8:00 Canada P%sT > Zone Canada/Yukon -9:00 Canada Y%sT > --- 230,236 ---- > Zone Canada/Atlantic -4:00 Canada A%sT > Zone Canada/Eastern -5:00 Canada E%sT > Zone Canada/Central -6:00 Canada C%sT > ! Zone Canada/Saskatchewan -6:00 - CST > Zone Canada/Mountain -7:00 Canada M%sT > Zone Canada/Pacific -8:00 Canada P%sT > Zone Canada/Yukon -9:00 Canada Y%sT > *************** > *** 290,296 **** > # Zone NAME GMTOFF RULES/SAVE FORMAT [UNTIL] > Zone Mexico/BajaNorte -8:00 Mexico P%sT > Zone Mexico/BajaSur -7:00 - MST > ! Zone Mexico/General -6:00 - CST > > ############################################################################### > > --- 294,300 ---- > # Zone NAME GMTOFF RULES/SAVE FORMAT [UNTIL] > Zone Mexico/BajaNorte -8:00 Mexico P%sT > Zone Mexico/BajaSur -7:00 - MST > ! Link Canada/Saskatchewan Mexico/General > > ###############################################################################

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please remove US/Pacific-New [forwarded with permission]
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

[My inclination would be to comment out the last two lines of the "pacificnew" file rather than making the changes indicated below, perhaps also adding a comment as to why they've been commented out. What do other folks feel? --ado] > Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 13:09:45 PST > From: eggert(a)twinsun.com (Paul Eggert) > Message-Id: <9210272109.AA11863(a)farside.twinsun.com> > To: ado(a)ncifcrf.gov > Subject: please remove US/Pacific-New > > The following patch removes US/Pacific-New, which causes more problems than it > cures (as I described in yesterday's message). Also, remove the file > `pacificnew'. > > *** Makefile Thu Jul 9 12:51:31 1992 > --- Makefile.fix Tue Oct 27 13:08:11 1992 > *************** > *** 189,195 **** > MANS= newctime.3 newtzset.3 tzfile.5 zic.8 zdump.8 > DOCS= Patchlevel.h README Theory $(MANS) date.1 Makefile > YDATA= africa antarctica asia australasia \ > ! europe northamerica southamerica pacificnew etcetera factory > NDATA= systemv > SDATA= solar87 solar88 solar89 > TDATA= $(YDATA) $(NDATA) $(SDATA) > --- 189,195 ---- > MANS= newctime.3 newtzset.3 tzfile.5 zic.8 zdump.8 > DOCS= Patchlevel.h README Theory $(MANS) date.1 Makefile > YDATA= africa antarctica asia australasia \ > ! europe northamerica southamerica etcetera factory > NDATA= systemv > SDATA= solar87 solar88 solar89 > TDATA= $(YDATA) $(NDATA) $(SDATA) >

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East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan [forwarded with permission]
by ado Oct. 28, 1992

Oct. 28, 1992

> Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 13:04:32 PST > From: eggert(a)twinsun.com (Paul Eggert) > Message-Id: <9210272104.AA11841(a)farside.twinsun.com> > To: ado(a)ncifcrf.gov > Subject: East-Saskatchewan -> Saskatchewan > > W. Jones <jones(a)skdad.usask.ca> writes that all of Saskatchewan is on CST year > round. I'll enclose his comments at the end of this message. So I propose > the following patch to the tz package: > > *** northamerica Thu Apr 23 10:34:33 1992 > --- northamerica.fix Tue Oct 27 12:58:38 1992 > *************** > *** 215,220 **** > --- 215,224 ---- > # be same as Pacific. Stick with rules posted in 1988 until more authoritative > # information is available. > > + # From W. Jones (October 27, 1992): > + # Since (I believe) around 1964, all of Saskatchewan is on CST year round, > + # by law [the U.S. Naval Observatory notwithstanding]. > + > # Rule NAME FROM TO TYPE IN ON AT SAVE LETTER/S > Rule Canada 1969 max - Oct lastSun 2:00 0 S > Rule Canada 1969 1986 - Apr lastSun 2:00 1:00 D > *************** > *** 226,232 **** > Zone Canada/Atlantic -4:00 Canada A%sT > Zone Canada/Eastern -5:00 Canada E%sT > Zone Canada/Central -6:00 Canada C%sT > ! Zone Canada/East-Saskatchewan -6:00 - CST # No DST as of 1987 > Zone Canada/Mountain -7:00 Canada M%sT > Zone Canada/Pacific -8:00 Canada P%sT > Zone Canada/Yukon -9:00 Canada Y%sT > --- 230,236 ---- > Zone Canada/Atlantic -4:00 Canada A%sT > Zone Canada/Eastern -5:00 Canada E%sT > Zone Canada/Central -6:00 Canada C%sT > ! Zone Canada/Saskatchewan -6:00 - CST > Zone Canada/Mountain -7:00 Canada M%sT > Zone Canada/Pacific -8:00 Canada P%sT > Zone Canada/Yukon -9:00 Canada Y%sT > > > Here are Jones's comments: > > Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 14:37:34 CST > From: jones(a)skdad.usask.ca (W. Jones) > To: eggert(a)twinsun.com > Cc: wright(a)sask.usask.ca > Organization: University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada > > ... for this site, in order to follow local time correctly > requires choosing the ruleset named "East-Saskatchewan". Sounds > plausible, until you consider that the measure of places for which a > ruleset "Saskatchewan" or "West-Saskatchewan" applies is zero. > > How did this come about? Since (I believe) around 1964, all of > Saskatchewan is on CST year round, by law; but since that distinction > makes us rebels to North American convention, it tends to get left out of > discussions for simplicity. Thus when the timezone package appeared in > 1987, lo and behold we were lumped with the other Central places, as > implied in this table in the documentation: > > # From U. S. Naval Observatory (January 19, 1989): > # CANADA NEW FDL 3.5H BEHIND UTC ST.JOHN'S > # CANADA NEW FDL 1.5H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA ATLANTIC 4 H BEHIND UTC HALIFAX > # CANADA ATLANTIC 3 H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA EASTERN 5 H BEHIND UTC TORONTO, MONTREAL, OTTAWA > # CANADA EASTERN 4 H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA CENTRAL 6 H BEHIND UTC REGINA, WINNIPEG > # CANADA CENTRAL 5 H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA MOUNTAIN 7 H BEHIND UTC CALGARY, EDMONTON > # CANADA MOUNTAIN 6 H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA PACIFIC 8 H BEHIND UTC VANCOUVER > # CANADA PACIFIC 7 H BEHIND UTC APR 3 - OCT 29 > # CANADA YUKON SAME AS PACIFIC DAWSON > > I complained, and the eventual result was the adjustment below: > > # Zone NAME GMTOFF RULES/SAVE FORMAT [UNTIL] > # Bob Devine says that DST *is* observed in Newfoundland > Zone Canada/Newfoundland -3:30 Canada N%sT > Zone Canada/Atlantic -4:00 Canada A%sT > Zone Canada/Eastern -5:00 Canada E%sT > Zone Canada/Central -6:00 Canada C%sT > Zone Canada/East-Saskatchewan -6:00 - CST # No DST as of 1987 > Zone Canada/Mountain -7:00 Canada M%sT > Zone Canada/Pacific -8:00 Canada P%sT > > apparently the U.S. Naval Observatory was believed infallible, thus the > fellow from Saskatchewan must be following some kooky (and new) local > practice, thus we'll just throw him a sop....

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US presidential election year politics help cause time zone bugs
by eggert＠twinsun.com Oct. 26, 1992

Oct. 26, 1992

Several people on the west coast of the US reported that their Unix systems failed to switch from daylight savings time to standard time yesterday, 26 October 1992. The reason? When they originally configured their systems, they were asked to choose one of the following time zone rules: US/Alaska US/Central US/Hawaii US/Pacific US/Aleutian US/East-Indiana US/Michigan US/Pacific-New US/Arizona US/Eastern US/Mountain US/Samoa ... Some people chose `US/Pacific-New' instead of `US/Pacific'. After all, who wants the old version when you can have the new version? Unfortunately, `US/Pacific-New' stands for ``Pacific Presidential Election Time'', which was passed by the House in April 1989 but never signed into law. In presidential election years, this rule would have delayed the PDT-to-PST switchover until after the election, to lessen the effect of broadcast news election projections on last-minute west-coast voters. Thus, US/Pacific-New and US/Pacific have always been identical -- until yesterday. This problem comes from combining Arthur David Olson's deservedly popular time zone software (which you can FTP from elsie.nci.nih.gov in pub/tz92b.tar.Z) with some overly terse vendor-supplied installation procedures. No doubt Olson did not use a more informative name like `US/Pacific-Presidential-Election' because of the 14-character file name length limit in many Unix file systems. In view of yesterday's experience, though, it seems unwise to make the hypothetical choice available under any name, since it gives free rein to Murphy's Law.

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