- tz - lists.iana.org

Re: [tz] Elliot - I want to talk about the TZ project ASAP...
by Todd Glassey Oct. 21, 2011

Oct. 21, 2011

On Wednesday, October 19, 2011 7:51:45 AM, Eliot Lear wrote: > Please see http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-lear-iana-timezone-database-04. > > Eliot > SNIP > Thanks - great start Elliot - let me make some devils advocate commentary. 0) We need two mailing lists - a general convo list and a second list for formal announcements as to changes in the DB itself. The reasons are that most of the relying parties who will subscribe to list #2 *(the DB Changes List) dont want anything else to do with this process., They are relying parties who need to be noticed when there are formal changes in the list only. A) we should tie the TZ use statement in the opening to to Log Correlation and tools like UNIX XDAS or the MITRE CEE groups work. It also needs to be noticed in the I-D that TZ's are a function of International Metrological Law and Treaty and are managed by the legal holders of those rights for the jurisdictions represented. B) The TZ information needs to be tied to some Authority Context so that each TZ is tied to a National or Judicial Context in some form. That means each TZ is functionally tied to a Originating Authority - in the US for instance this would be 15 USC 260 which then further stratifies the time data to a set of Metrological Authorities within that Legal Instance of Time. That means a TZ Management Actor for each TZ published must be established. I suggest adding a STAKEHOLDER ROLE to the Submission Practice and that the Stakeholder may amend the content of the publication-list with respect to the TZ(s) they hold control over here, and that a simple notice from the Stakeholder to the DB Coordinator should trigger both an update to the list and a public-service notice to a new TZ Announce List which is specific to TZ Changes and availability Statements from the DB Coordinator/DBA C) The Data Base is actually a legal publication and the IETF has nothing to say about its presentation of that content. Further the IETF failing to properly make changes creates both civil and potentially criminal liabilities in a number of situations that OLSON was immune from under the 11th Amendment Protections accorded to the NIH. To sidestep that liability there are a number of things we can do with the Stakeholder Role suggested in B too - we should talk more about this and who actually owns this data.Likewise, since this is a legal document that is being published with is a distillation of a number of metrological and trade treaties the IETF or ANY part of the IANA stand in the way of a legal jurisdiction making immediate changes to that list, its international law. Sop the Draft needs work there. Todd -- Todd S. Glassey - CISM CIFI CTO Certichron Inc This message contains information which may be confidential and/or privileged. Unless you are the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the intended recipient), you may not read, use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any information contained in the message. If you have received the message in error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail and delete the message and any attachment(s) thereto without retaining any copies. Further we have a formal OPT OUT Policy posted on our website pertaining to the use of any Email Addresses gleaned or taken from any source, web, mailing lists, previous customer lists etc. In all instances we choose to formally OPT OUT and this notice constitutes formal disclosure that you may not collect, buy or sell or provide access to this email address or any pertaining to our DNS MX Record Publication License posted on the web at http://www-wp.certichron.com/?page_id=3947.

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Defense fund
by Thom Hehl Oct. 21, 2011

Oct. 21, 2011

Please forgive me if this is inappropriate to discuss on this list, but I was wondering if a defense fund has been set up for the guys defending against the Astrolabe lawsuit. I started the Protect the timezone database facebook group and would be happy to help fundraise. If inappropriate, please reply to me off list. Thanks.

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Attempting to get speedier tz updates
by Robert Elz Oct. 21, 2011

Oct. 21, 2011

Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 14:16:11 +0100 From: "Clive D.W. Feather" <clive(a)davros.org> Message-ID: <20111020131611.GD27386(a)davros.org> In a message that started out on another thread I don't want to get involved with ... | While it would be nice if they sent us updates, we can't force them. That's true, but I kind of suspect, that we have never even asked. I had been wondering about that, and considering doming something about it, for months now - and just possibly "considering" is all it would ever have been, however, perhaps we should attempt a little better than that. Attempting to contact everyone responsible, directly, would be a lot of work, just identifying the parties involved, so I thought it might be possible to take an easier route, and just ask the UN to do the contact work for us - that is, we write to the UN Secretary General, and ask that the message be redistributed to all member states - the message being a request that they ask whoever (whatever agency) is responsible for actually implementing time issues, to please inform us of any planned or actual changes - and perhaps, if they're able, any historical data they have. If people think this is a reasonable idea then I will implement it. Note: I don't much care if you expect it to actually succeed - if it fails, it has cost almost nothing, but if anyone can see an actual negative possibility from this, then I'd like to hear about it. Also, while I'm happy to draft (and circulate to the list before sending) the letter involved, it would probably be nice from the UN's viewpoint, if we could send in both English and French (and anything else? I doubt we need to consider attempting all 6 official languages.) That I cannot do, so I'd need assistance with translation into French (and anything else suggested as a good idea) - and that assistance needs to be from a fluent (native) speaker I believe, not someone who learned the language in school. Any volunteers? (It won't be very long.) kre

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temporary timezone database home ...
by Robert Elz Oct. 21, 2011

Oct. 21, 2011

First, I am assuming this copy of the list is actually functioning, (and I've just received jhawk's message which demonstrates that it is) I don't believe it has been used for actual messages before that one, but as ado has indicated that the list at elsie has been (for now anyway) terminated - and given the plan was to migrate from it eventually anyway, may never return, we can but hope this version of the list is functional. Some of you who receive this message may have been removed from the elsie version of the list recently, or altered your subscription details - if that applies to you, use the iana.org message sent on the 1st of this month to all subscribers to their list for instructions on how to modify or delete your subscription. Don't send requests to me (or anyone else on the list) there's nothing I (or we) can do about it - and most certainly, do not send requests to the list itself asking to be removed. Unfortunately, there are probably a few people who were added to the elsie list since it was cloned at iana.org but there's nothing much we can do about that - if anyone is contacted by anyone who believes they should be on the list, but is no longer receiving messages, direct them to the iana website for list subscriptions. Next, while elsie's ftp server is shut down, munnari.oz.au isn't, and the tz database & code remains available from here. Further, I will not respond to requests from (almost) anyone to cease making those files available (including Arthur and Paul - but by all means feel free to try if you need to to satisfy some obligation to cease making the data available - I'll ignore you, but you will at least have used every reasonable effort...) Second, regardless of this, the world's governments continue to adjust their view of their local timezones & summer time adjustments, so we need to continue updating the database (at least). There are several updates that will be needed soon. For now, until someone else volunteers, I'm prepared to make the updates, in much the same way that Arthur did, and then make new releases available from munnari's ftp server. I suspect that it is unlikely that either Arthur or Paul will be able to assist much with this in the coming months, so I'm hoping that others will assist where possible. For now, I'm aware of changes needed for Armenia, Fiji, Bolivia, Brazil, and of course, the changes that (might be) needed for Russia. If there's anything else I missed, please let me know. Unfortunately, I don't have the sccs (or is it rcs or something these days) master files, so I won't be able to do quite the same job that Arthur did, but I can keep all versions so they can be checked into a version control system later. It would be good if a few others, especially people in jurisdictions that tend not to simply bow down to US court rulings, would keep copies of the code and data, and make them publicly available via ftp or http (this is not of huge public interest, the resources needed to provide this service should not be very noticeable). All I know of the lawsuit is what jhawk's message indicated - eventually I assume we'll find out what trademark or patent that someone believes is being infringed (a little hard to believe either, but who knows...) The URL's of the current versions of the files from munnari.oz.au are ... ftp://munnari.oz.au/pub/tzcode2011i.tar.gz ftp://munnari.oz.au/pub/tzdata2011k.tar.gz and of course, the historical files (most versions that were ever previously released) are in ftp://munnari.oz.au/pub/oldtz/ kre

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Re: [tz] Robert Elz as TZ coordinator
by David Braverman Oct. 21, 2011

Oct. 21, 2011

I hate to throw a spanner in the works, and I do think KRE is right for the job, but are we all certain he even wants this greatness thrust upon him?

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Re: [tz] Robert Elz as TZ coordinator
by SM Oct. 20, 2011

Oct. 20, 2011

At 14:54 20-10-2011, M3 Sweatt wrote: >Is there an outline or summary of what the requirements and actions >of the coordinator would be going forward? draft-lear-iana-timezone-database-04 discusses about the TZ coordinator. >Generally no objections, just curious if the Coordinator role and >responsibility has been memorialized somewhere. Although the draft (it will be published as a RFC) discusses the role and responsibilities, it is more about the TZ community using its best judgement to keep up the good work that was started by Ado. Robert commented on the current work ( http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2011-October/008093.html ). I think that the message at http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2011-October/007993.html summaries the tone to expect from the TZ community. Regards, -sm

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time zone suggestions
by Steven Abner Oct. 20, 2011

Oct. 20, 2011

Hi Not sure if I should contact the organization or Zefram. But it looks like the new management might be open to some queries and/or options from outside sources. This information pertains to northamerica, and one was accepted by you already, where Mr. Olson implied it was correct, so you may have to alter the information I am supplying. They are suggestions only, and were done to aid parsing of the tz data, different parser with more strict rules for converting. Feel free to ignore, or pick out what you feel relevant, as only the Sitka change was of any real importance. The Anchorage one was to keep the northamerica rules from needing the translation unit of the europe file rules, which I altered to follow the majority of your data files. This is one of the patches I use to set your data to my data. Sorry to intrude, Steve

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List Administration Note (How to unsubscribe)
by Kim Davies Oct. 20, 2011

Oct. 20, 2011

Hi all, For those who no longer wish to be subscribed to the Time Zone mailing list, emailing all the subscribers of this list of your desire is not the recommended method. Please visit https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/tz where you can unsubscribe or change your subscription options. Alternatively, if you can email _from your subscribed address_ to tz-request(a)iana.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". If your address does not show as on the list, you'll need to identify under which email address you originally subscribed from. If you need help with this, please forward an email you received from this list to tz-owner(a)iana.org, but preserve all the mail headers, so we can try and trace where it was sent. Thanks, kim

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Ukraine to keep winter time after all
by Philip.Pizzey＠sita.aero Oct. 18, 2011

Oct. 18, 2011

Hi there, I've been following the recent discussions on this list about the timezone changes in Ukraine, Russia and Belarus. Today my Ukrainian colleagues have informed me that the Ukrainian parliament have decided that they will go to winter time this year after all. Please see the following link: http://portal.rada.gov.ua/rada/control/en/publish/article/info_left?art_id=… > > The Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine Resolution "On changing the Order of Computation of Time in the Territory of Ukraine" No. 3755-VI of September 20, 2011 was declared invalid. > Cheers, Phil.

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Short notice: Ukraine invalidates law to introduce permanent DST
by udo.schwedt＠obi.de Oct. 18, 2011

Oct. 18, 2011

As far as I understand, the recent change to the Ukranian time zone (Europe/Kiev) to introduce permanent daylight saving time (similar to Russia) was reverted today: http://portal.rada.gov.ua/rada/control/en/publish/article/info_left?art_id=… AFAICS, this means that the current Kiev time zone (UTC/GMT +3 hours) will be changed back to former Ukrainian standard time (UTC/GMT +2 hours) by the end of this month (October 2011). Thus the original DST rules (that were changed with tzinfo2011k) will have to be restored. I don't know how such near-term situations are usually handled (I'm fairly new to this list), but I'd like to bring this to your attention and propose a change at short notice. Thanks, -- Udo -- IMPORTANT NOTICE: This email is confidential, may be legally privileged, and is for the intended recipient only. Access, disclosure, copying, distribution, or reliance on any of it by anyone else is prohibited and may be a criminal offence. Please delete if obtained in error and email confirmation to the sender.

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