Huyen Le Khac: On 2024-01-09 01:51, Huyen Le Khac wrote:

Hi Jim

I appreciate your engagement and the time you took to respond. However, I would like to address some points to ensure clarity on certain matters.

Likewise, I appreciate your engagement. Thank you.

…In reference to the UASG working group charter, it is crucial to note that the chair's role is designated for one calendar year. To avoid any confusion, a calendar year is defined as the period between January 1 and December 31. It has nothing to do with ICANN's fiscal year, which concludes on June 30 as mentioned by you. The charter explicitly specifies a calendar year, and I believe it is important to adhere to the documented guidelines.…

You are correct. I found the wording you mention, for instance in the EAI Working Group charter[1], page 2:

Chair of the Working Group… The chair role is for one calendar year. He/she should be nominated one month prior to the end of the current chair’s term to ensure a smooth transition. There is no limit on the number of terms chair(s) may have.… Given that clear statement of "calendar year", it is curious that the calls for nomination (e.g. [2]) went out in July, not the previous December. It looks like the people running the process silently slipped from calendar year to fiscal year, and from conducting the selection before the start of the term to just after the start of the term.

I agree with you that it is desirable for the leadership to address this difference. You also say,

…I believe it's crucial for all UASG to align with the documented charters to maintain consistency and transparency within the UASG framework until they are not updated again with community consensus.…

You said earlier[3],

…I strongly advocate for a revision of the terms for working group chairs and vice chairs, with a maximum term of 2 years. Following this period, individuals should be encouraged to take a rest period, allowing for the infusion of fresh perspectives and the involvement of new contributors.… My conclusion differs from yours. You appear to believe that there are new contributors clamouring to be involved, and the existing WG leaders are blocking them. That is not my experience, based on participating actively in three working groups.

I see that each of these working group has only 2-4 active members who are present for most meetings, plus maybe 10 more who appear and contribute for a fraction of the meetings, or who appear for most of the meetings but do not contribute actively. Thus we do not have many active contributors who have the experience and proven track record to take on the role of working group vice-chair, nor many vice-chairs ready for the role of chair. I suspect that some of the current working group chairs would love to take a rest period, but they stay because no qualified person offers to replace them. More fundamentally, I think that the most important task of us in the UASG is to advance Universal Acceptance in the world. A secondary task is to behave within the UASG in the spirit of our charters and codes of conduct. Behaving within the letter of the charters only comes third.  If I can have the first and second, I am willing to be understanding on the third. (And to be clear, I am not satisfied with our performance of the first task: we have less impact on Universal Acceptance in the world than we could.) It seems to me that you propose making the letter of the charters the most important task. Are you willing for the group to have even less impact in promoting Universal Acceptance, just so that working group chairs step down on Dec 31st? For anyone on this list who would like to see current Working Group chairs or Ambassadors step down, I have a challenge for you: become the strong candidate. Become visibly active advancing Universal Acceptance, within UASG or out in the world. Come work with us in the working groups. Set up a UA Day event[4], with or without UASG funding. Personally, if I see you establishing a record of contributing within UASG or in the world, I will be open to supporting you for a vice-chair role. And if I see you working effectively as a vice-chair, I will be open to supporting you for a WG chair role. And I would not be surprised if a current, rather exhausted, WG chair might support you also. Best regards,       —Jim DeLaHunt, (not a chair or a vice-chair of anything) [1] UASG Technology Working Group Charter <https://uasg.tech/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/UASG-Tech-Working-Group-Charter...> [2] "[UA-Measurement] Nominations for UA Measurement WG Vice-Chair positions - Now Open" <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-measurement/2023-July/000783.html> [3] "[UA-discuss] UASG Working Group Positions Renewal Status" <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-discuss/2024-January/004433.html> [4] Call for Proposals<https://universalacceptance.day>

Dr. Marc Miller, My gratitude for your recent expression of agreement with us. We are extremely honoured to see that a legend from the ICANN community is supporting us. It is encouraging to see individuals like yourself recognizing the importance of addressing governance issues for the effective functioning of working group chairs, vice chairs, ambassadors, and Statement of Interest (SOI) within UASG. Regrettably, despite the efforts made by members of the UASG community to highlight these governance issues, it has been disheartening to observe a lack of responsiveness from the present leadership team. Members have consistently raised concerns about the current system, yet there has been little to no feedback or response from the leadership chair. Members are eager to contribute and make meaningful changes, but the absence of communication from the leadership is hindering progress. I believe that your continued advocacy for addressing governance issues will play a crucial role in bringing attention to these concerns especially during ICANN public forums. Your voice carries weight, and I hope that it encourages the leadership team to allocate the necessary time and resources to respond to community members and provide feedback on the raised concerns. Thank you once again for your support, and I look forward to seeing positive developments in addressing these governance issues within the UASG community. My two cents, Huyen Le Khac On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 at 11:58, Marc Tl <marct717@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello Azhar Ibrahim and Huyan Le Khac,

I am writing to express my agreement with the sentiment regarding the serious governance issues within the Universal Acceptance Steering Group (UASG), as discussed in ICANN 78 supported by past chair and other members of UASG.

It has been observed that despite documented protocols, there seems to be a gap between what is outlined and the actual implementation within UASG. During the UASG governance session at ICANN 78, the leadership—Anil Jain (Chair), Nitin Walia (Vice Chair), and Nabil Benamar (Vice Chair)—reassured the community that in ICANN 79, they would provide a comprehensive update on the steps taken to address various governance issues. These include matters such as Statement of Interest (SOI) implementation, the updating of UASG documents, defining terms for UASG working group chairs and vice-chairs, UA ambassadors, UA day, and more.

Given the importance of governance in ensuring the effectiveness of UASG, it is crucial that the commitments made by the leadership during ICANN 78 are upheld. As the community eagerly anticipates ICANN 79, it is expected that the UASG leadership will reconfirm their dedication to addressing these governance issues. The community is looking forward to a detailed update during the upcoming session in ICANN79 by these leaders of UASG, where the leadership can shed light on the progress made and respond to any questions raised by the community.

I appreciate you both bringing back the attention to this matter, and I trust that the UASG leadership will stand by their commitment to transparency and accountability during the ICANN 79 session.

I would like to explicitly request the UASG leadership to confirm that they are holding the ICANN 79 session, as committed during ICANN 78. This session is of utmost importance, and the community relies on the transparency and accountability promised by the leadership. Running away from this commitment would be detrimental to the trust and credibility of the UASG.

Marc Miller

Sr. Director

South Carolina

On Tue, Jan 9, 2024 at 3:22 PM Huyen Le Khac via UA-discuss < ua-discuss@icann.org> wrote:

...

Hi Jim

I appreciate your engagement and the time you took to respond. However, I would like to address some points to ensure clarity on certain matters.

Though, communication was intended for the chair of UASG, and I noticed that you provided insights that are commonly seen in emails on ua-discuss. While I value your contributions, I would like to redirect the focus to the specific issue at hand.

In reference to the UASG working group charter, it is crucial to note that the chair's role is designated for one calendar year. To avoid any confusion, a calendar year is defined as the period between January 1 and December 31. It has nothing to do with ICANN's fiscal year, which concludes on June 30 as mentioned by you. The charter explicitly specifies a calendar year, and I believe it is important to adhere to the documented guidelines.

Regarding the UA Ambassador Program, I appreciate your mention of the renewable 12-month term, but it is essential to accurately represent the charter's language. As per the UA Ambassador Program charter, it states, "The designation of UA Ambassador will be for a period of twelve months and will be renewable as a decision of the UA Coordination Group." It's essential to emphasize that no position within UASG is permanent, and renewability is subject to the discretion of the UA Coordination Group. When there is no announcement from UASG for renewal or acceptance of all new pending applications then how come these certificates were issued for Jan- December 2024? https://twitter.com/fundeticbolivia/status/1742908117271085421/photo/1

Also hope that the period of Jan –Dec 2024 mentioned in above certificate issued with Signatures of UASG Chair, automatically clears all your concerns about the calendar year in UASG.

I believe it's crucial for all UASG to align with the documented charters to maintain consistency and transparency within the UASG framework until they are not updated again with community consensus.

My two cents,

Huyen Le Khac

On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 at 14:44, Jim DeLaHunt <list+uasg@jdlh.com> wrote:

...

Azhar Ibrahim, Huyan Le Khac: On 2024-01-08 23:33, Azhar Ibrahim via UA-discuss wrote:

Dear Anil,

I am reaching out to seek clarification on the current status of the renewal process for UASG working group positions, specifically those of UA Ambassadors, UASG Working Group Chairs, and Vice Chairs.

Thank you for your interest in transparency and good governance of UASG.

I have a couple of questions about your message, however:

As outlined in the UASG charter,…

Which charter are you referring to? There is a charter for UASG overall[1] and a second charter for UA Ambassadors[2], and a third for Local Initiatives[2], and four for the four Working Groups[2]. I do not see anything in the UASG Charter[1] which mention working groups, UA ambassadors, or local initiatives. Maybe you mean the working group charters?

…these positions hold a one-calendar-year term, which officially concluded on December 31, 2023.…

What is the source of your information that the terms concluded on December 31?

The chairs and vice chairs of the working groups were announced most recently[3] in August 2023, and these appointments were for "FY24". So, their terms should end at the end of FY24.

When does FY24 end for UASG? I am not sure, but it seems[4] that ICANN's fiscal year ends on June 30. Thus I guess these working group chairs end their terms on June 30, 2024. But I agree with you that a clarification would be helpful.

…Recently, I came across a Facebook post by one of the UA Ambassadors who proudly shared a certificate for the year 2024. This has led to some confusion within the community.…

I am concerned about confusion within the community. Can you describe this community? In which part of the world was it? Is there evidence of the confusion, such as messages in public email list archives, which other UASG people could review?

If you are concerned about UA Ambassador terms specifically, the UA Ambassador Program Charter[2] says, "UA Ambassadors will be selected by the UA Coordination Group and will hold the position for a renewable 12 months." I don't see anything there about a particular year end.

…I am seeking clarification on whether new UA Ambassadors have already been appointed, and if all previous ambassadors and working group chairs and vice-chairs have been automatically renewed for the year 2024. If not then how are they leading the working group meetings and why their names are still on UASG.tech? …

Note that UA Ambassadors do not lead UASG Working Group meetings, the Working Group chairs and vice-chairs do.

…Understanding the importance of transparency and effective communication, could you please provide….

Transparency and effective communication is important for the work of UASG. We could use some more of it in this group. I applaud your advocacy of it.

And do you know what else is important for the work of UASG? Participation in the working groups.

I would welcome a chance to hear contributions from both of you at working group meetings. I personally joined the Technology Working Group meeting[5] at 15:00UTC yesterday. Will I see you both at the EAI Working Group meeting[6] at 15:00 UTC today, 9 Jan 2024? Or the Measurement WG meeting[7] at 15:00 UTC on 10 Jan 2024? Or perhaps you have comments to offer on the draft UA Curriculum[8]? [1] Overall UASG charter <https://uasg.tech/uasg-charter/> <https://uasg.tech/uasg-charter/> [2] Page with links to 6 charters, for UA Ambassadors, Local Initiatives, Working Group charters <https://uasg.tech/working-groups/> <https://uasg.tech/working-groups/> [3] "[UA-discuss] UASG Working Group Chairs and Vice Chairs" <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-discuss/2023-August/004371.html> <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-discuss/2023-August/004371.html> [4] <https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/current-en> <https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/current-en> [5] UA Technology WG meeting 2024-01-08 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-tech/2024-January/000745.html> <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-tech/2024-January/000745.html> [6] UA EAI WG meeting 2024-01-09 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-eai/2024-January/002055.html> <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-eai/2024-January/002055.html> [7] UA Measurement WG meeting 2024-01-10 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-measurement/2024-January/000868.html> <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-measurement/2024-January/000868.html> [8] Draft UA Curriculum <https://community.icann.org/display/TUA/Draft+UA+Curriculum> <https://community.icann.org/display/TUA/Draft+UA+Curriculum>

Best regards, —Jim DeLaHunt, (not a chair or a vice-chair of anything)

-- --Jim DeLaHunt, jdlh@jdlh.com http://blog.jdlh.com/ (http://jdlh.com/) multilingual websites consultant, Vancouver, Canada

_______________________________________________ UA-discuss mailing list UA-discuss@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ua-discuss

---

By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.

Here’s what SSAC had to say about emoji domain names (they are opposed). SAC095 SSAC Advisory on the Use of Emoji in Domain Names 25 May 2017 (icann.org)<https://itp.cdn.icann.org/en/files/security-and-stability-advisory-committee...> From: UA-discuss <ua-discuss-bounces@icann.org> On Behalf Of Mehta Youngs via UA-discuss Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2024 8:14 To: Huyen Le Khac <khaclehuyen@gmail.com> Cc: Anil Jain <anil@nixi.in>; ua-discuss@icann.org Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [UA-discuss] UASG Working Group Positions Renewal Status Hi all, It seems like an appropriate time to chime in as an observer: have been following along here, trying to keep up with developments. It seems that there are various interests being represented with the principal being an inclusive domain authority. My personal view is that Unicode 1993 has enough of a character set to represent basically everyone, and I don't think that "emoji TLDs" are a great idea. Unless I have accidentally signed up (it has happened before) I'm not part of any working group or committee, and remain committed to observing and auditing the process, if necessary. Cannot say that I am especially well-versed in web nomenclature strictures or the reasoning behind any limitations that aren't purely technical. Thanks to everyone who has contributed and please keep up the important work! Best, Mehta VY On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 1:27 AM Huyen Le Khac via UA-discuss <ua-discuss@icann.org<mailto:ua-discuss@icann.org>> wrote: Dr. Marc Miller, My gratitude for your recent expression of agreement with us. We are extremely honoured to see that a legend from the ICANN community is supporting us. It is encouraging to see individuals like yourself recognizing the importance of addressing governance issues for the effective functioning of working group chairs, vice chairs, ambassadors, and Statement of Interest (SOI) within UASG. Regrettably, despite the efforts made by members of the UASG community to highlight these governance issues, it has been disheartening to observe a lack of responsiveness from the present leadership team. Members have consistently raised concerns about the current system, yet there has been little to no feedback or response from the leadership chair. Members are eager to contribute and make meaningful changes, but the absence of communication from the leadership is hindering progress. I believe that your continued advocacy for addressing governance issues will play a crucial role in bringing attention to these concerns especially during ICANN public forums. Your voice carries weight, and I hope that it encourages the leadership team to allocate the necessary time and resources to respond to community members and provide feedback on the raised concerns. Thank you once again for your support, and I look forward to seeing positive developments in addressing these governance issues within the UASG community. My two cents, Huyen Le Khac On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 at 11:58, Marc Tl <marct717@gmail.com<mailto:marct717@gmail.com>> wrote: Hello Azhar Ibrahim and Huyan Le Khac, I am writing to express my agreement with the sentiment regarding the serious governance issues within the Universal Acceptance Steering Group (UASG), as discussed in ICANN 78 supported by past chair and other members of UASG. It has been observed that despite documented protocols, there seems to be a gap between what is outlined and the actual implementation within UASG. During the UASG governance session at ICANN 78, the leadership—Anil Jain (Chair), Nitin Walia (Vice Chair), and Nabil Benamar (Vice Chair)—reassured the community that in ICANN 79, they would provide a comprehensive update on the steps taken to address various governance issues. These include matters such as Statement of Interest (SOI) implementation, the updating of UASG documents, defining terms for UASG working group chairs and vice-chairs, UA ambassadors, UA day, and more. Given the importance of governance in ensuring the effectiveness of UASG, it is crucial that the commitments made by the leadership during ICANN 78 are upheld. As the community eagerly anticipates ICANN 79, it is expected that the UASG leadership will reconfirm their dedication to addressing these governance issues. The community is looking forward to a detailed update during the upcoming session in ICANN79 by these leaders of UASG, where the leadership can shed light on the progress made and respond to any questions raised by the community. I appreciate you both bringing back the attention to this matter, and I trust that the UASG leadership will stand by their commitment to transparency and accountability during the ICANN 79 session. I would like to explicitly request the UASG leadership to confirm that they are holding the ICANN 79 session, as committed during ICANN 78. This session is of utmost importance, and the community relies on the transparency and accountability promised by the leadership. Running away from this commitment would be detrimental to the trust and credibility of the UASG. Marc Miller Sr. Director South Carolina On Tue, Jan 9, 2024 at 3:22 PM Huyen Le Khac via UA-discuss <ua-discuss@icann.org<mailto:ua-discuss@icann.org>> wrote: Hi Jim I appreciate your engagement and the time you took to respond. However, I would like to address some points to ensure clarity on certain matters. Though, communication was intended for the chair of UASG, and I noticed that you provided insights that are commonly seen in emails on ua-discuss. While I value your contributions, I would like to redirect the focus to the specific issue at hand. In reference to the UASG working group charter, it is crucial to note that the chair's role is designated for one calendar year. To avoid any confusion, a calendar year is defined as the period between January 1 and December 31. It has nothing to do with ICANN's fiscal year, which concludes on June 30 as mentioned by you. The charter explicitly specifies a calendar year, and I believe it is important to adhere to the documented guidelines. Regarding the UA Ambassador Program, I appreciate your mention of the renewable 12-month term, but it is essential to accurately represent the charter's language. As per the UA Ambassador Program charter, it states, "The designation of UA Ambassador will be for a period of twelve months and will be renewable as a decision of the UA Coordination Group." It's essential to emphasize that no position within UASG is permanent, and renewability is subject to the discretion of the UA Coordination Group. When there is no announcement from UASG for renewal or acceptance of all new pending applications then how come these certificates were issued for Jan- December 2024? https://twitter.com/fundeticbolivia/status/1742908117271085421/photo/1 Also hope that the period of Jan –Dec 2024 mentioned in above certificate issued with Signatures of UASG Chair, automatically clears all your concerns about the calendar year in UASG. I believe it's crucial for all UASG to align with the documented charters to maintain consistency and transparency within the UASG framework until they are not updated again with community consensus. My two cents, Huyen Le Khac On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 at 14:44, Jim DeLaHunt <list+uasg@jdlh.com<mailto:list%2Buasg@jdlh.com>> wrote: Azhar Ibrahim, Huyan Le Khac: On 2024-01-08 23:33, Azhar Ibrahim via UA-discuss wrote: Dear Anil, I am reaching out to seek clarification on the current status of the renewal process for UASG working group positions, specifically those of UA Ambassadors, UASG Working Group Chairs, and Vice Chairs. Thank you for your interest in transparency and good governance of UASG. I have a couple of questions about your message, however: As outlined in the UASG charter,… Which charter are you referring to? There is a charter for UASG overall[1] and a second charter for UA Ambassadors[2], and a third for Local Initiatives[2], and four for the four Working Groups[2]. I do not see anything in the UASG Charter[1] which mention working groups, UA ambassadors, or local initiatives. Maybe you mean the working group charters? …these positions hold a one-calendar-year term, which officially concluded on December 31, 2023.… What is the source of your information that the terms concluded on December 31? The chairs and vice chairs of the working groups were announced most recently[3] in August 2023, and these appointments were for "FY24". So, their terms should end at the end of FY24. When does FY24 end for UASG? I am not sure, but it seems[4] that ICANN's fiscal year ends on June 30. Thus I guess these working group chairs end their terms on June 30, 2024. But I agree with you that a clarification would be helpful. …Recently, I came across a Facebook post by one of the UA Ambassadors who proudly shared a certificate for the year 2024. This has led to some confusion within the community.… I am concerned about confusion within the community. Can you describe this community? In which part of the world was it? Is there evidence of the confusion, such as messages in public email list archives, which other UASG people could review? If you are concerned about UA Ambassador terms specifically, the UA Ambassador Program Charter[2] says, "UA Ambassadors will be selected by the UA Coordination Group and will hold the position for a renewable 12 months." I don't see anything there about a particular year end. …I am seeking clarification on whether new UA Ambassadors have already been appointed, and if all previous ambassadors and working group chairs and vice-chairs have been automatically renewed for the year 2024. If not then how are they leading the working group meetings and why their names are still on UASG.tech? … Note that UA Ambassadors do not lead UASG Working Group meetings, the Working Group chairs and vice-chairs do. …Understanding the importance of transparency and effective communication, could you please provide…. Transparency and effective communication is important for the work of UASG. We could use some more of it in this group. I applaud your advocacy of it. And do you know what else is important for the work of UASG? Participation in the working groups. I would welcome a chance to hear contributions from both of you at working group meetings. I personally joined the Technology Working Group meeting[5] at 15:00UTC yesterday. Will I see you both at the EAI Working Group meeting[6] at 15:00 UTC today, 9 Jan 2024? Or the Measurement WG meeting[7] at 15:00 UTC on 10 Jan 2024? Or perhaps you have comments to offer on the draft UA Curriculum[8]? [1] Overall UASG charter <https://uasg.tech/uasg-charter/><https://uasg.tech/uasg-charter/> [2] Page with links to 6 charters, for UA Ambassadors, Local Initiatives, Working Group charters <https://uasg.tech/working-groups/><https://uasg.tech/working-groups/> [3] "[UA-discuss] UASG Working Group Chairs and Vice Chairs" <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-discuss/2023-August/004371.html><https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-discuss/2023-August/004371.html> [4] <https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/current-en><https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/current-en> [5] UA Technology WG meeting 2024-01-08 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-tech/2024-January/000745.html><https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-tech/2024-January/000745.html> [6] UA EAI WG meeting 2024-01-09 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-eai/2024-January/002055.html><https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-eai/2024-January/002055.html> [7] UA Measurement WG meeting 2024-01-10 <https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-measurement/2024-January/000868.html><https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ua-measurement/2024-January/000868.html> [8] Draft UA Curriculum <https://community.icann.org/display/TUA/Draft+UA+Curriculum><https://community.icann.org/display/TUA/Draft+UA+Curriculum> Best regards, —Jim DeLaHunt, (not a chair or a vice-chair of anything) -- --Jim DeLaHunt, jdlh@jdlh.com<mailto:jdlh@jdlh.com> http://blog.jdlh.com/ (http://jdlh.com/) multilingual websites consultant, Vancouver, Canada _______________________________________________ UA-discuss mailing list UA-discuss@icann.org<mailto:UA-discuss@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ua-discuss _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on. _______________________________________________ UA-discuss mailing list UA-discuss@icann.org<mailto:UA-discuss@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ua-discuss _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.