New zone for DE, split from Europe/Berlin

The German exclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen, did not start observing DST in 1980 as the rest of DE (West Germany at that time) and DD (East Germany at that time) did. DD merged into DE, the area is currently covered by code DE in ISO 3166-1, which in turn is covered by the zone Europe/Berlin. Source for the time in Büsingen 1980: http://www.videoportal.sf.tv/video?id=c012c029-03b7-4c2b-9164-aa5902cd58d3 Suggested zone name: Europe/Busingen (removing diacritics as does UN/LOCODE) OR Europe/Buesingen (resolving as in German language) -- Tobias Conradi Rheinsberger Str. 18 10115 Berlin, Germany http://tobiasconradi.com

It is too early to propose this as a new zone for tzdata. The practice for each zone in tzdata is that also the complete history from the beginning of standard time must be included in the zone file. For Busingen, only the exception in 1980 is confirmed by research. It is not yet known what this exclave did in 1941 - 1949 and in 1916 - 1918 when Germany had DST / war time but Switzerland did not or did differently. I have written a few days ago to Busingen authorities in the hope to get information about its timezone history. On 12.09.11 19:24, Mr tobias conradi wrote:
The German exclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen, did not start observing DST in 1980 as the rest of DE (West Germany at that time) and DD (East Germany at that time) did.
DD merged into DE, the area is currently covered by code DE in ISO 3166-1, which in turn is covered by the zone Europe/Berlin.
Source for the time in Büsingen 1980: http://www.videoportal.sf.tv/video?id=c012c029-03b7-4c2b-9164-aa5902cd58d3
Suggested zone name:
Europe/Busingen (removing diacritics as does UN/LOCODE) OR Europe/Buesingen (resolving as in German language)

The German exclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen, did not start observing DST in 1980 as the rest of DE (West Germany at that time) and DD (East Germany at that time) did.
This means that Busingen was like Zurich in 1980 (since Switzerland started using DST in 1981 rather than 1980).
From 1950 through 1979, and from 1981 to the present, Zurich and Berlin have been the same. Does anyone know whether Busingen started using DST in 1981 (when both Berlin and Zurich were using it)? Does anyone know whether Busingen was like Berlin or was like Zurich (or, for that matter, was doing something else) before 1950? Thanks for any light you can shed.
--ado

On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 10:31 PM, Arthur David Olson <arthurdavidolson@gmail.com> wrote:
The German exclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen, did not start observing DST in 1980 as the rest of DE (West Germany at that time) and DD (East Germany at that time) did.
This means that Busingen was like Zurich in 1980 (since Switzerland started using DST in 1981 rather than 1980). From 1950 through 1979, and from 1981 to the present, Zurich and Berlin have been the same. Does anyone know whether Busingen started using DST in 1981 (when both Berlin and Zurich were using it)?
As reason for deviating from Berlin the news broadcast gave problems due to other rules in Zurich, since local activity is highly involved with Zurich zone. If in 1981 Berlin and Zürich did the same, one could assume Busingen/Buesingen did what these two zones did. Since Büsingen belongs to Germany it would be linked to Berlin whenever possible, I think.
Does anyone know whether Busingen was like Berlin or was like Zurich (or, for that matter, was doing something else) before 1950?
Büsingen belongs to Konstanz District says http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%BCsingen_am_Hochrhein Since 1810 Konstanz District was part of Baden says http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landkreis_Konstanz#Geschichte In absence of other reports one could use the Baden data. A pre-1970 zone Mannheim covering Baden was proposed by Alois Treindl at: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.time.tz/3951 I would rather call it State than Province. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baden_(Land) AFAIK a Land of Germany is called State in English. t -- Tobias Conradi Rheinsberger Str. 18 10115 Berlin Germany http://tobiasconradi.com/tobias_conradi

Here's one possible way to reflect Busingen, Germany following Zurich rather than Berlin in 1980. Another possibility would be to add a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" and a... Link Europe/Zurich Europe/Busingen ...line in "europe" The Link could be avoided by adding a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Zurich Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" but that might confuse some readers (and could break anything out in the wild that relies on the third fields of "zone.tab" lines to be unique, as is true now). --ado diff -r -c before/europe after/europe *** before/europe 2012-03-03 11:49:57.414792100 -0500 --- after/europe 2012-03-03 11:50:03.779603300 -0500 *************** *** 1215,1220 **** --- 1215,1237 ---- # However, Moscow did not observe daylight saving in 1945, so # this was equivalent to CEMT (GMT+3), not GMT+4. + # From Tobias Conradi (2011-09-12): + # The German enclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), + # surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen, + # did not start observing DST in 1980 as the rest of DE + # (West Germany at that time) and DD (East Germany at that time) did. + # DD merged into DE, the area is currently covered by code DE in ISO 3166-1, + # which in turn is covered by the zone Europe/Berlin. + # + # Source for the time in Büsingen 1980: + # <a href=" http://www.videoportal.sf.tv/video?id=c012c029-03b7-4c2b-9164-aa5902cd58d3"> + # http://www.videoportal.sf.tv/video?id=c012c029-03b7-4c2b-9164-aa5902cd58d3 + # </a> + + # From Arthur David Olson (2012-03-03): + # Büsingen and Zurich have shared clocks since 1970; + # we don't need a new zone. + # We do want to reflect Büsingen's status in zone.tab # Rule NAME FROM TO TYPE IN ON AT SAVE LETTER/S Rule Germany 1946 only - Apr 14 2:00s 1:00 S diff -r -c before/zone.tab after/zone.tab *** before/zone.tab 2012-03-03 11:50:00.971598300 -0500 --- after/zone.tab 2012-03-03 11:50:07.071209000 -0500 *************** *** 141,147 **** CD -1140+02728 Africa/Lubumbashi east Dem. Rep. of Congo CF +0422+01835 Africa/Bangui CG -0416+01517 Africa/Brazzaville ! CH +4723+00832 Europe/Zurich CI +0519-00402 Africa/Abidjan CK -2114-15946 Pacific/Rarotonga CL -3327-07040 America/Santiago most locations --- 141,147 ---- CD -1140+02728 Africa/Lubumbashi east Dem. Rep. of Congo CF +0422+01835 Africa/Bangui CG -0416+01517 Africa/Brazzaville ! CH +4723+00832 Europe/Zurich Switzerland, Busingen Germany CI +0519-00402 Africa/Abidjan CK -2114-15946 Pacific/Rarotonga CL -3327-07040 America/Santiago most locations *************** *** 160,166 **** CX -1025+10543 Indian/Christmas CY +3510+03322 Asia/Nicosia CZ +5005+01426 Europe/Prague ! DE +5230+01322 Europe/Berlin DJ +1136+04309 Africa/Djibouti DK +5540+01235 Europe/Copenhagen DM +1518-06124 America/Dominica --- 160,166 ---- CX -1025+10543 Indian/Christmas CY +3510+03322 Asia/Nicosia CZ +5005+01426 Europe/Prague ! DE +5230+01322 Europe/Berlin Germany (except Busingen) DJ +1136+04309 Africa/Djibouti DK +5540+01235 Europe/Copenhagen DM +1518-06124 America/Dominica

On Sat, 03 Mar 2012 18:12:48 +0100, Arthur David Olson <arthurdavidolson@gmail.com> wrote:
+ # From Tobias Conradi (2011-09-12): + # The German enclave of Büsingen (http://www.buesingen.de/), + # surrounded by the Swiss canton Schaffhausen,
Should that not be "The German exclave of..."? Regards, Sascha

Arthur David Olson wrote:
Here's one possible way to reflect Busingen, Germany following Zurich rather than Berlin in 1980. [comments on the zone.tab lines for Berlin and Zurich]
It contradicts the rule, stated at the top of zone.tab, that the comment field is "present if and only if the country has multiple rows". (And yes, my repackager will detect a breach of that rule and kick it up for human attention.)
Another possibility would be to add a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" and a... Link Europe/Zurich Europe/Busingen ...line in "europe"
I like this better. It accurately reflects (in zone.tab) that Busingen is actually part of DE, which it *should* reflect if you're going to treat it as a special case at all. By the way, you need another "0" on the front of that longitude.
The Link could be avoided by adding a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Zurich Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" but that might confuse some readers
This appears to claim that Zurich is part of DE, which is not correct, and that it's located at the coordinates of Busingen, also not correct.
(and could break anything out in the wild that relies on the third fields of "zone.tab" lines to be unique, as is true now).
The partitioning of the list into countries would seem to imply that a zone name (city) should appear under only one country. I think you'd need a city to actually straddle a border or have changed hands, or something similar, to justify double appearance. Zurich doesn't qualify for that, but Busingen might. -zefram

If one would use the proposal from the diff
! CH +4723+00832 Europe/Zurich Switzerland, Busingen Germany ! DE +5230+01322 Europe/Berlin Germany (except Busingen) what is the meaning of the country code column then? Has there ever been a tz zone that covered territory in more than one area defined by a /current/ ISO 3166 country code edition?
I see this exists backward, e.g. Europe/Berlin and Asia/Aden each cover areas that /have had attached/ ISO 3166 codes for two countries, but I am not aware that a 1:n (n>1) relation for "tz zone" : "ISO 3166"-country ever existed at a point in time were the ISO 3166 codes were still active. Note: The first ISO 3166 country code list is reported to have been published in 1974 (http://www.iso.org/iso/country_codes/background_on_iso_3166/development_of_i...) i.e. ca. 4 year after the Unix epoch (1970-01-01 00:00:00 UTC), which point in time after which the tz db aims to be correct according to the Theory file. Tobias On Sat, Mar 3, 2012 at 6:12 PM, Arthur David Olson <arthurdavidolson@gmail.com> wrote:
Here's one possible way to reflect Busingen, Germany following Zurich rather than Berlin in 1980.
Another possibility would be to add a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" and a... Link Europe/Zurich Europe/Busingen ...line in "europe"
The Link could be avoided by adding a... DE +474149+084125 Europe/Zurich Busingen ...line to "zone.tab" but that might confuse some readers (and could break anything out in the wild that relies on the third fields of "zone.tab" lines to be unique, as is true now).
--ado .... ! CH +4723+00832 Europe/Zurich Switzerland, Busingen Germany .... ! DE +5230+01322 Europe/Berlin Germany (except Busingen)
-- Tobias Conradi Rheinsberger Str. 18 10115 Berlin Germany http://tobiasconradi.com/tobias_conradi
participants (6)
-
Alois Treindl
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Arthur David Olson
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Mr tobias conradi
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Sascha Wildner
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Tobias Conradi
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Zefram