Timezone change for Asia/Qyzylorda

Hi, Starting 21 December 2018 00:00, Qyzylorda oblast, Kazakhstan (Asia/Qyzylorda) has moved back from +6 to +5. Link: http://adilet.zan.kz/rus/docs/P1800000817 -- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12

Hey Zhanbolat, this is already covered on; https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2018-December/027315.html On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 10:05 PM Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
Starting 21 December 2018 00:00, Qyzylorda oblast, Kazakhstan (Asia/Qyzylorda) has moved back from +6 to +5. Link: http://adilet.zan.kz/rus/docs/P1800000817
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12
-- Soner Gönül http://sonergonul.net http://twitter.com/sonergonul

Cool, thanks! On Sun, Dec 30, 2018 at 1:08 AM Soner Gönül <soner.gonul@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Zhanbolat, this is already covered on;
https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2018-December/027315.html
On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 10:05 PM Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
Starting 21 December 2018 00:00, Qyzylorda oblast, Kazakhstan (Asia/Qyzylorda) has moved back from +6 to +5. Link: http://adilet.zan.kz/rus/docs/P1800000817
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12
-- Soner Gönül http://sonergonul.net http://twitter.com/sonergonul
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12

Also, I wanted to comment about creating another new timezone Asia/Qostanay. Why would we need to duplicate existing timezones? Our country has only two real timezones (+5 and +6). People in Qostanay oblast can just switch to +5 (Asia/Aqtobe). Thank you On Sun, Dec 30, 2018 at 1:17 AM Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Cool, thanks!
On Sun, Dec 30, 2018 at 1:08 AM Soner Gönül <soner.gonul@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Zhanbolat, this is already covered on;
https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2018-December/027315.html
On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 10:05 PM Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
Starting 21 December 2018 00:00, Qyzylorda oblast, Kazakhstan (Asia/Qyzylorda) has moved back from +6 to +5. Link: http://adilet.zan.kz/rus/docs/P1800000817
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12
-- Soner Gönül http://sonergonul.net http://twitter.com/sonergonul
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 at 14:38, Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Why would we need to duplicate existing timezones? Our country has only two real timezones (+5 and +6). People in Qostanay oblast can just switch to +5 (Asia/Aqtobe).
Per the theory.html file, our guideline is to split zones where timezone history has diverged at any point since 1970. Paul mentioned the details a few days ago at https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2018-December/027319.html -- Tim Parenti

Ok, big thanks for the clarification. On Sun, Dec 30, 2018 at 1:43 AM Tim Parenti <tim@timtimeonline.com> wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 at 14:38, Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Why would we need to duplicate existing timezones? Our country has only two real timezones (+5 and +6). People in Qostanay oblast can just switch to +5 (Asia/Aqtobe).
Per the theory.html file, our guideline is to split zones where timezone history has diverged at any point since 1970. Paul mentioned the details a few days ago at https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz/2018-December/027319.html
-- Tim Parenti
-- Zhanbolat Raimbekov, Rochester Institute of Technology '12

On Dec 29, 2018, at 11:43 AM, Tim Parenti <tim@timtimeonline.com> wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 at 14:38, Zhanbolat Raimbekov <janbo87@gmail.com> wrote:
Why would we need to duplicate existing timezones? Our country has only two real timezones (+5 and +6). People in Qostanay oblast can just switch to +5 (Asia/Aqtobe).
Per the theory.html file, our guideline is to split zones where timezone history has diverged at any point since 1970.
...because the information in the tzdb isn't just used for converting the current time from UTC to local time, it's used for converting times in the past from UTC to local time, e.g. $ ls -ld ~/postponed -rw------- 1 gharris staff 5509 Oct 11 2007 /Users/gharris/postponed and, this having originally been developed for UN*Xes, "times in the past" go back at least to the UN*X Epoch, i.e. January 1, 1970, 00:00:00 UTC.

[Subject line changed from "Re: [tz] Timezone change for Asia/Qyzylorda".] Guy Harris wrote:
$ ls -ld ~/postponed -rw------- 1 gharris staff 5509 Oct 11 2007 /Users/gharris/postponed
My personal record for old files is this one: $ ls -l --time-style=+'%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S %z' $HOME/.plan -r--r--r-- 2 eggert faculty 386 1981-07-14 16:01:39 -0700 /home/eggert/.plan and yes, 1981 is really when I last changed that file, on a VAX-11/780 running 4.2BSD when I was teaching at the University of California, Santa Barbara. The file is still used when someone fingers me on one of our research machines, or when web crawlers visit <https://web.cs.ucla.edu/~eggert/.plan.txt>; the plan.txt link is why .plan has a link count of 2 in the above listing. Extra credit if you can identify the quote. One can pretend to have older timestamps by using the utimensat system call, or something like it, and this will test the tz database further back. I regularly assign to students the problem of setting a file's timestamp to 1918-11-11 11:00 UT (the end of World War I) and then I ask them why it doesn't work when they run their program on a file residing on a Network Appliance file server.

Paul Eggert said:
My personal record for old files is this one:
$ ls -l --time-style=+'%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S %z' $HOME/.plan -r--r--r-- 2 eggert faculty 386 1981-07-14 16:01:39 -0700 /home/eggert/.plan
and yes, 1981 is really when I last changed that file, on a VAX-11/780 running
I can beat you: -rw-rwSr-- 1 clive parent 74560 1980-04-28 04:58:00 +0100 /u/clive/relics/games/elite/elites.exe (That surprised me, but I'm pretty sure it's genuine. I believe it's actually a Windows, or MS-DOS, executable that I was given by the author.) I also have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 with a range of times, but I'm a bit more suspicious about them. Though since they are Infocom games they might be genuine.
Extra credit if you can identify the quote.
Not sure: it looks like something from the Devil's DP Dictionary, by Stan Kelly-Bootle. Now if I could only find my copy ... -- Clive D.W. Feather | If you lie to the compiler, Email: clive@davros.org | it will get its revenge. Web: http://www.davros.org | - Henry Spencer Mobile: +44 7973 377646

Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
I also have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 with a range of times, but I'm a bit more suspicious about them. Though since they are Infocom games they might be genuine.
I have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 (copied from 5 1/4 floppies), but those that I have been able to verify are really newer. I suspect that these fake dates were caused by some bug or incompatibility before or during the copy. I also have a number of files dated '1979-12-31 23:xx', maybe caused by the same bug but with DST changed. The oldest file created by me that I have been able to find is this one (a schematic diagram made with Orcad): -rw-r--r-- 1 antonio users 776 1986-06-06 12:35 block.sch

On December 29, 2018 7:27:48 PM EST, Antonio Diaz Diaz <antonio@gnu.org> wrote:
Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
I also have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 with a range of times, but I'm a bit more suspicious about them. Though since they are Infocom games they might be genuine.
I have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 (copied from 5 1/4 floppies),
but those that I have been able to verify are really newer.
1980-01-01 is the (PC|MS)-DOS epoch. Early PCs did not have a battery backed clock, and so every boot would require manually setting the clock -- and many people did not bother to do so, hence timestamps of that date are not to be trusted. -GAWollman

Garrett Wollman said:
I also have a number of files dated 1980-01-01 with a range of times, but I'm a bit more suspicious about them.
1980-01-01 is the (PC|MS)-DOS epoch. Early PCs did not have a battery backed clock, and so every boot would require manually setting the clock -- and many people did not bother to do so, hence timestamps of that date are not to be trusted.
That would explain those, yes. -- Clive D.W. Feather | If you lie to the compiler, Email: clive@davros.org | it will get its revenge. Web: http://www.davros.org | - Henry Spencer Mobile: +44 7973 377646

On 31/12/2018 13:32, Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
1980-01-01 is the (PC|MS)-DOS epoch. Early PCs did not have a battery backed clock, and so every boot would require manually setting the clock -- and many people did not bother to do so, hence timestamps of that date are not to be trusted. That would explain those, yes.
I've still got the 8" floppy disks from the TI system that predated my getting my first PC ... only problem is the lack of hardware that would actually read them to see what the dates were. Certainly around 1980 as that was when I got my masters in computer systems. And I was working on TV systems for a few years before that with EMI Electronics. -- Lester Caine - G8HFL ----------------------------- Contact - https://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - https://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - https://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - https://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - https://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk

Lester Caine said:
I've still got the 8" floppy disks from the TI system that predated my getting my first PC ... only problem is the lack of hardware that would actually read them to see what the dates were.
Would they have been CP/M? If so, there was no date field in the disc directory. (I managed and extended a CP/M clone back in the early to mid 1980s.) -- Clive D.W. Feather | If you lie to the compiler, Email: clive@davros.org | it will get its revenge. Web: http://www.davros.org | - Henry Spencer Mobile: +44 7973 377646

On 03/01/2019 11:44, Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
I've still got the 8" floppy disks from the TI system that predated my getting my first PC ... only problem is the lack of hardware that would actually read them to see what the dates were. Would they have been CP/M? If so, there was no date field in the disc directory.
(I managed and extended a CP/M clone back in the early to mid 1980s.)
TI had it's own OS running on the TMS9900 family of chips and we were building hardware to 'time correct' video signals controlled by the TMS9995 processor. I'm fairly sure that the files were timestamped as we used that to version the code builds. There were not many options for code management in those days :) Nowadays a single chip does the work of a 6U rack of boards ... and does it to a higher resolution ... -- Lester Caine - G8HFL ----------------------------- Contact - https://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - https://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - https://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - https://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - https://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk
participants (9)
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Antonio Diaz Diaz
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Clive D.W. Feather
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Garrett Wollman
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Guy Harris
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Lester Caine
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Paul Eggert
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Soner Gönül
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Tim Parenti
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Zhanbolat Raimbekov