question re zone America/Punta_Arenas in Chile

In 2016, Chile introduced a new time zone for it south-most province Magallanes, and for this reason a new zone Zone America/Punta_Arenas -4:43:40 - LMT 1890 -4:42:46 - SMT 1910 Jan 10 -5:00 - -05 1916 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1918 Sep 10 -4:00 - -04 1919 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1927 Sep 1 -5:00 Chile -05/-04 1932 Sep 1 -4:00 - -04 1942 Jun 1 -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 -5:00 - -05 1947 May 21 23:00 -4:00 Chile -04/-03 2016 Dec 4 -3:00 - -03 has been created. before it followed Zone America/Santiago -4:42:46 - LMT 1890 -4:42:46 - SMT 1910 Jan 10 # Santiago Mean Time -5:00 - -05 1916 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1918 Sep 10 -4:00 - -04 1919 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1927 Sep 1 -5:00 Chile -05/-04 1932 Sep 1 -4:00 - -04 1942 Jun 1 -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1946 Jul 15 -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Sep 1 # central Chile -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 -5:00 - -05 1947 May 21 23:00 -4:00 Chile -04/-03 The new zone differs from zone Santiago at two points: - it does not have the 1946/47 DST - it differs from 2016 Dec 4, the reason of its creation. I wonder on which basis the 1946/47 DST was left out for Puntas_Arenas? Is that documented somewhere? The main reason why I ask: My two sources Shanks and Gabriel have always claimed that zone America/Santiago is only good for the province of Santiago, but that the rest of Chile did not have DST between 1927 and 1932. This is why in my private pre-1970 TZ extension I have an extra zone for 'rest of Chile besides Santiago' Zone America/Chile/Antofagasta -4:41:36 - LMT 1890 -4:42:46 - SMT 1910 Jan 10 # Santiago Mean Time -5:00 - -05 1916 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1918 Sep 10 -4:00 - -04 1919 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1927 Sep 1 -5:00 - -05 1932 Sep 1 0 follow America/Santiago which leaves out the 1927-1932 DST. It has however the 1946/47 DST. I have another zone, based on Shanks and Gabriel, for Vaparaiso, which leaves out the 1946/47 DST, but has a one-summer 1931/1932 DST. Zone America/Chile/Vina_del_Mar -4:46:16 - LMT 1890 -4:42:46 - SMT 1910 Jan 10 # Santiago Mean Time -5:00 - -05 1916 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1918 Sep 10 -4:00 - -04 1919 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1927 Sep 1 -5:00 - -05 1931 Sep 1 -5:00 Chile -05/-04 1932 Sep 1 -4:00 - -04 1942 Jun 1 -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 0 follow America/Santiago Sadly, I have currently no sources for that beyond Shanks and Gabriel. We would need local newspaper archives from a non-Santiago newspaper for 1927-1932 to confirm. But it this is true, we have to assume that province Magellanes behaved like 'the rest of Chile' and not like Santiago before the split in 2016. That means that it should be: Zone America/Punta_Arenas -4:43:40 - LMT 1890 -4:42:46 - SMT 1910 Jan 10 -5:00 - -05 1916 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1918 Sep 10 -4:00 - -04 1919 Jul 1 -4:42:46 - SMT 1927 Sep 1 -5:00 - -05 1932 Sep 1 -4:00 - -04 1942 Jun 1 -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 -5:00 - -05 1947 May 21 23:00 -4:00 Chile -04/-03 2016 Dec 4 -3:00 - -03

Thanks for pointing out what appears to be a transcription error when I created America/Punta_Arenas in 2016. I installed the attached proposed patch into the development version.

On Fri, 11 Mar 2022 at 12:39, Alois Treindl via tz <tz@iana.org> wrote:
I wonder on which basis the 1946/47 DST was left out for Puntas_Arenas? Is that documented somewhere?
Although it doesn't appear to have been documented in our extended commentary, there's indeed a clue in the short line-comment that reads "central Chile". It can sometimes get confusing looking at UNTIL lines, but the only place the UT offsets of the two zones actually deviate in our 2021e data is the roughly six-week period from through 1946-07-15 through 1946-08-31, inclusive. Compare the extract from America/Punta_Arenas: -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 and America/Santiago: -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1946 Jul 15 -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Sep 1 # central Chile -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 So what happened on 1946-07-15? Well, sure enough, an emergency decree which only applied to the central part of the country: https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460715... Núm. 3,891. Adelanta la hora oficial en el territorio nacional comprendido entre las provincias de Coquimbo y Concepción, inclusives, por el plazo de 30 días No. 3,891. Advancing the official time in the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive, for a period of 30 days Specifically (my Google-assisted translation): "In the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive, the Official Time will be advanced by sixty minutes, for a period of 30 days, starting from 24:00 on July 14 [of the current yaer]." That would include Santiago, which advanced to -03, but did not reach so far south as Magallanes, which would have stayed on -04. The decree contemplated "[t]hat this advancement of the Official Time, even though it has been proposed for the cities of Santiago and Valparaíso only, must be agreed with that of other cities, due to the connection of various activities that require it, such as, for example, the operation of rail services". As the 30 days reached their expiry, the time change was extended: https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460814... Núm. 4,506. Prorroga hasta el 31 del mes en curso la vigencia del cambio de hora oficial en el territoria nacional comprendido entre las provincias de Coquimbo y Concepción, inclusives No. 4,506. Extending until the 31st of the current month [August] the validity of the official time change in the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive Later in August, a bill reunified the country's clocks: https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460828... (translated excerpt) "The official time for the entire Republic will be from 1 September to 31 March of each year, the meridian of the Astronomical Observatory of Lo Espejo, advanced by 42 minutes and 45 seconds, which corresponds to the 20th time zone, four hours west of Greenwich, and will be called Summer Time. From 1 April to 31 August, it will be that of the Lo Espejo Observatory Meridian delayed by 17 minutes and 15 seconds, which corresponds to the 19th time zone, five hours west of Greenwich, and will be called Winter Time." Technically, this bill came into force "from the date of its publication", but given that that was sufficiently close to the 1946-08-31 expiry of the extended emergency act anyway, and the rest of the country would have already been on -04, it seems just as likely that clocks changed in the center of the country on 1946-08-31 24:00, as previously scheduled. Under this law, the 1946/1947 observance of Summer Time at -04 lasted for all six of its months, but our data show the observance of Winter Time at -05 was cut short after about seven weeks on 1947-05-21 when -04 was adopted as the new Standard Time. This differs somewhat from our horaoficial.cl source https://web.archive.org/web/20120306042032/http://www.horaoficial.cl/ing/hor... which implies the divergence *began* on 1946-09-01 rather than *ended* on it, but the legal texts seem clear to me: Our 2021e data is right. On Sat, 12 Mar 2022 at 14:44, Paul Eggert via tz <tz@iana.org> wrote:
Thanks for pointing out what appears to be a transcription error when I created America/Punta_Arenas in 2016. I installed the attached proposed patch into the development version.
Unfortunately, I believe this means that the data change here should at least be reverted. We can also better specify the transition dates and expand commentary as necessary. And while it's before our 1970 cutoff for zone creation, those tracking expanded pre-1970 data should be keen to only put the correct areas on -03 for these few weeks in 1946. It really was only the middle bit on -03, not the south, and not the north. -- Tim Parenti

I've prepared the attached patches to address and further document this divergence. 0001 reverts the data change portion of the errant commit 6d6a21f592c421dcebf39b07a6271d68187cfa15 published on Saturday 2022-03-12. 0002 significantly expands our commentary on Chilean transitions in 1946 and 1947 and also adjusts LMT/SMT to match Chilean law. In particular, even recent Chilean law still refers to time reckoned as "the meridian of the Astronomical Observatory of Lo Espejo, advanced by 42 minutes and 45 seconds" https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/publicaciones/2018/11/23/42212/01/... While preparing these patches, I also noticed this in our commentary: # From Paul Eggert (2019-09-01): # The above says the Magallanes exception expires 2022-04-02 at 24:00, # so in theory, they will revert to -04/-03 after that. # For now, assume that they will not revert, # since they have extended the expiration date once already. So there's a decent chance we'll be hearing from Chile soon anyway. In any case, the attached patches (along with a couple small clerical patches) are now installed in the development repository. -- Tim Parenti On Mon, 14 Mar 2022 at 23:27, Tim Parenti <tim@timtimeonline.com> wrote:
On Fri, 11 Mar 2022 at 12:39, Alois Treindl via tz <tz@iana.org> wrote:
I wonder on which basis the 1946/47 DST was left out for Puntas_Arenas? Is that documented somewhere?
Although it doesn't appear to have been documented in our extended commentary, there's indeed a clue in the short line-comment that reads "central Chile".
It can sometimes get confusing looking at UNTIL lines, but the only place the UT offsets of the two zones actually deviate in our 2021e data is the roughly six-week period from through 1946-07-15 through 1946-08-31, inclusive. Compare the extract from America/Punta_Arenas: -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 and America/Santiago: -5:00 - -05 1942 Aug 1 -4:00 - -04 1946 Jul 15 -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Sep 1 # central Chile -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1
So what happened on 1946-07-15? Well, sure enough, an emergency decree which only applied to the central part of the country:
https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460715... Núm. 3,891. Adelanta la hora oficial en el territorio nacional comprendido entre las provincias de Coquimbo y Concepción, inclusives, por el plazo de 30 días No. 3,891. Advancing the official time in the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive, for a period of 30 days
Specifically (my Google-assisted translation): "In the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive, the Official Time will be advanced by sixty minutes, for a period of 30 days, starting from 24:00 on July 14 [of the current yaer]."
That would include Santiago, which advanced to -03, but did not reach so far south as Magallanes, which would have stayed on -04.
The decree contemplated "[t]hat this advancement of the Official Time, even though it has been proposed for the cities of Santiago and Valparaíso only, must be agreed with that of other cities, due to the connection of various activities that require it, such as, for example, the operation of rail services".
As the 30 days reached their expiry, the time change was extended:
https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460814... Núm. 4,506. Prorroga hasta el 31 del mes en curso la vigencia del cambio de hora oficial en el territoria nacional comprendido entre las provincias de Coquimbo y Concepción, inclusives No. 4,506. Extending until the 31st of the current month [August] the validity of the official time change in the national territory between the provinces of Coquimbo and Concepción, inclusive
Later in August, a bill reunified the country's clocks:
https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/versiones-anteriores/do-h/19460828... (translated excerpt) "The official time for the entire Republic will be from 1 September to 31 March of each year, the meridian of the Astronomical Observatory of Lo Espejo, advanced by 42 minutes and 45 seconds, which corresponds to the 20th time zone, four hours west of Greenwich, and will be called Summer Time. From 1 April to 31 August, it will be that of the Lo Espejo Observatory Meridian delayed by 17 minutes and 15 seconds, which corresponds to the 19th time zone, five hours west of Greenwich, and will be called Winter Time."
Technically, this bill came into force "from the date of its publication", but given that that was sufficiently close to the 1946-08-31 expiry of the extended emergency act anyway, and the rest of the country would have already been on -04, it seems just as likely that clocks changed in the center of the country on 1946-08-31 24:00, as previously scheduled. Under this law, the 1946/1947 observance of Summer Time at -04 lasted for all six of its months, but our data show the observance of Winter Time at -05 was cut short after about seven weeks on 1947-05-21 when -04 was adopted as the new Standard Time.
This differs somewhat from our horaoficial.cl source
https://web.archive.org/web/20120306042032/http://www.horaoficial.cl/ing/hor... which implies the divergence *began* on 1946-09-01 rather than *ended* on it, but the legal texts seem clear to me: Our 2021e data is right.
On Sat, 12 Mar 2022 at 14:44, Paul Eggert via tz <tz@iana.org> wrote:
Thanks for pointing out what appears to be a transcription error when I created America/Punta_Arenas in 2016. I installed the attached proposed patch into the development version.
Unfortunately, I believe this means that the data change here should at least be reverted. We can also better specify the transition dates and expand commentary as necessary.
And while it's before our 1970 cutoff for zone creation, those tracking expanded pre-1970 data should be keen to only put the correct areas on -03 for these few weeks in 1946. It really was only the middle bit on -03, not the south, and not the north.
-- Tim Parenti

On 2022-03-16 03:24, Tim Parenti via tz wrote:
0002 significantly expands our commentary on Chilean transitions in 1946 and 1947 and also adjusts LMT/SMT to match Chilean law. In particular, even recent Chilean law still refers to time reckoned as "the meridian of the Astronomical Observatory of Lo Espejo, advanced by 42 minutes and 45 seconds" https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/publicaciones/2018/11/23/42212/01/...
Thanks for the source, but I think the law is interpreted incorrectly in tzdb version 2022a: • Law Number 8,522 was promulgated on 1946-08-28, not the day before. • That law contains an "artícolo transitorio" which specifies: Artícolo transitorio. Al tiempo de entrar en vigor la presente ley, se fijará la hora oficial para toda la República con arreglo al horário de Verano señalado en el artículo 1.o. (Transitional article. At the time when this law takes effect, the official time for the whole Republic will be set according to summer time as indicated in the 1st article.) [my translation] That article would be superfluous if the switch to summer time had happened on 1946-09-01 (as tzdb currently says) because that would have been the switching date already indicated in article 1. Thus, the switch to summer time happened earlier than 1946-09-01 (as wrongly stated by Shanks). • That law applies to Punta Arenas as well -- all of Chile had a brief summer time period with UT - 04 h until 1947-04-01. Hence, both tzdb timezones should be amended: Zone America/Santiago ... - -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Sep 1 # central Chile - -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 + -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Aug 29 # central Chile + -5:00 1:00 -04 1947 Apr 1 Zone America/Punta_Arenas ... - -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 + -4:00 - -04 1946 Aug 29 + -5:00 1:00 -04 1947 Apr 1 It would take further evidence (such as newspaper clips) in order to ascertain the precise hour of the switch in both cases. The proposed change implies switches at different instants. Michael Deckers.

On 3/18/22 09:09, Michael H Deckers wrote:
On 2022-03-16 03:24, Tim Parenti via tz wrote:
https://www.diariooficial.interior.gob.cl/publicaciones/2018/11/23/42212/01/...
• Law Number 8,522 was promulgated on 1946-08-28, not the day before.
Although the above URL indeed reprints the 1946-08-28 publication in Diario Oficial, I don't see a promulgation date there. <https://www.bcn.cl/leychile/navegar?i=285254> says law 8,522 was promulgated the day before. That being said, the law says it takes effect when it's published so the promulgation date doesn't matter to us.
• That law contains an "artícolo transitorio" which specifies:
Artícolo transitorio. Al tiempo de entrar en vigor la presente ley, se fijará la hora oficial para toda la República con arreglo al horário de Verano señalado en el artículo 1.o.
(Transitional article. At the time when this law takes effect, the official time for the whole Republic will be set according to summer time as indicated in the 1st article.) [my translation]
That article would be superfluous if the switch to summer time had happened on 1946-09-01 (as tzdb currently says) because that would have been the switching date already indicated in article 1. Thus, the switch to summer time happened earlier than 1946-09-01 (as wrongly stated by Shanks).
Yes, and we already have Santiago switching to -03 daylight saving time (I wouldn't call it "summer time" :-) on 1946-07-15.
Hence, both tzdb timezones should be amended:
Zone America/Santiago ... - -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Sep 1 # central Chile - -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 + -4:00 1:00 -03 1946 Aug 29 # central Chile + -5:00 1:00 -04 1947 Apr 1
Zone America/Punta_Arenas ... - -4:00 - -04 1947 Apr 1 + -4:00 - -04 1946 Aug 29 + -5:00 1:00 -04 1947 Apr 1
It would take further evidence (such as newspaper clips) in order to ascertain the precise hour of the switch in both cases.
It would indeed be good to have further evidence. Strictly interpreted, the Chilean law published August 28, 1946 required citizens in Punta Arenas to move their clocks back an hour immediately, and then forward an hour on August 31. I very much doubt whether that's what was intended or what citizens did; surely they just kept their clocks on -04. Although the TZDB change you're proposing does that, it sets tm_isdst on August 29 even though neither the law nor the previous practice said DST was being observed August 29. I expect it's better to set the DST flag when the new law said DST started. (I doubt whether newspapers will help us resolve the tm_isdst issue, as there would be no practical reasons to tell the citizens to do anything to their clocks.) Similarly, the law required citizens in Santiago to move their clocks back *two* hours on August 28 (from -03 to -05), and then forward an hour on August 31. This is also implausible. Surely they just picked a time to move back an hour from -03 to -04. Here, I think it more likely that it was done at the end of August 31, since that would have given more time to notify the citizens of the change. I was just talking to my father about this, and he jokingly suggested that I fly down to Santiago and check printed newspaper archives there. Unfortunately that would take more time than I can spare.... Proposed patch attached and installed into the development database.

On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 at 10:09, Michael H Deckers < michael.h.deckers@googlemail.com> wrote:
• Law Number 8,522 was promulgated on 1946-08-28, not the day before.
The text of the law specifies that it was *promulgated* (that is, made known) on Tuesday 1946-08-27, but it was *published* in 'Diario Oficial' the following day. But since Article 3 states that the law would come into force from the date of its publication, the conclusion is the same: The law came into force on Wednesday 1946-08-28. • That law contains an "artícolo transitorio" Good catch. This greatly simplifies the apparent corner cases which Paul had discussed in his 1 July message and gives a reasonably clear date for a single transition in central Chile, also 1946-08-28. It would take further evidence (such as newspaper clips) in
order to ascertain the precise hour of the switch in both cases. The proposed change implies switches at different instants.
Although this is technically true as the two zones were off by an hour prior to this 1946-08-28 transition, it was a no-op for wall-clocks in Chile's northern and southern regions. On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 at 14:13, Paul Eggert via tz <tz@iana.org> wrote:
I expect it's better to set the DST flag when the new law said DST started.
Lacking further specificity, let's presume the change came into effect in Santiago and central Chile at 24:00 -03. Similarly, let's change the DST bit for the rest of the mainland an hour later, when they reached 24:00 -04, as that's most consistent with Chile's general history of midnight transitions. Proposed further patch attached and installed into the development repo. -- Tim Parenti
participants (4)
-
Alois Treindl
-
Michael H Deckers
-
Paul Eggert
-
Tim Parenti