[[--Translated text (en -> es)--]] Asunto: Re: RES: OP De: carlosaguirre62@hotmail.com Corea del Sur: Su falta de respeto es increíble, y no es mi manera de comportarme. Así que, como usted ha dicho: nuestras posiciones están muy lejos. Lamentablemente, su falta de capacidad para discutir y su falta de conocimiento sobre este asunto, ciego por su ignorancia, me hacen dar fin a esta discusión. Cuando usted será capaz de discutir en forma civilizada, dime y tal vez podemos continuar. Carlos Dionisio Aguirre NCA Consejo de la GNSO - ICANN el ex miembro de ALAC por LACRALO Abogado - Especialista en Derecho de los Negocios Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Córdoba - Argentina - * 54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423 http://ar.ageiadensi.org

From: rok@bango.org.bb To: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Date: Wed, 15 Aug 2012 07:25:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

What took you so long to realise that we are on all fours here? The reality of the law of association is that LACRALO is not independent and sovereign, but you insist that it is. The reality of the association between LACRALO and icann is that LACRALO is a satellite of ICANN but you insist that it is not. Were you asleep when you signed?

Furthermore, in this relationship a few people cannot decide what LACRALO is after the fact and any attempt to take it in another direction will be contrary to the rights of those who signed the MoU and you will not be acting as LACRALO but as yourselves.

ROK

From: carlos dionisio aguirre Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 10:44 PM To: rok@bango.org.bb ; lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: RE: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

ROK: with all my respect I ask sorry to your intelligence, and please ask if (your intelligence) could say to me what is the foundation of it position about LACRALO and why consider is not independent and soverign. Sorry again for what you consider an insult, I only wanted to give my position about that. On the other side : If you consider an insult my position about a determinate issue, I can consider your actitude like a disrespect, maximum when you appeal to discredit but without foundation.

Carlos Dionisio Aguirre NCA GNSO Council - ICANN former ALAC member by LACRALO Abogado - Especialista en Derecho de los Negocios Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Cordoba - Argentina - *54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423 http://ar.ageiadensi.org

...

From: rok@bango.org.bb To: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2012 21:33:40 -0400 Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

Offensive? I find it an insult to my intelligence when LACRALO is described as sovereign and independent.

ROK

-----Original Message----- From: asoto@ibero-americano.org Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 9:23 PM To: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Cc: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

[[--Translated text (es -> en)--]]

Subject: Re: RES: OP From: asoto@ibero-americano.org

I think any discussion in LACRALO opinin justifies this magnitude. What estviendo least here, is the anxiety of travel, and are facts that have been demonstrated. As always, please pour opinions, please apply well justify it. Otherwise, exemplify, we consider a all with the same yardstick. It is highly offensive. And definitely the worst I've seen input to ICANN. Regards

Alberto Soto

----- Original Message ----- From: lac-discuss-es-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [Mailto: lac-discuss-es-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of rok@bango.org.bb Posted on: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 9:48 pm To: lac-discuss-es@atlarge-lists.icann.org CC: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

[[- Translated text (in -> en) -]]

Subject: Re: RES: OP From: rok@bango.org.bb

Some people want a car to take a truck load. All this LACRALO talk about being independent is a nonsense. We must begin with the reason why LACRALO is established. It was not a club or party political. Comenzcon the objective is to get tickets especfico Caribbean and Latin America Internet users, not for us to by sb walk out happy.

It seems that there are some who want to appropriate LACRALO to make it we want to be. When that day LACRALO is no longer relevant to the ICANN, I hope it passes Caribbean peticin Renen and ICANN to make direct contributions to ICANN and to leave Los Angeles to continue its merry way to nowhere.

LACRALO has lost focus and has entered into a desert politician steep where to vote in favor of the officials is the prize ... and where people are pushed to the charges if their lives depend on it.

Depressing!

South Korea

----- Original Message ----- From: Carlos Dionisio Aguirre Posted on: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 10:25 To: Carlton Samuels Cc: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP

My dear Brother: At this time I can `t share with you. I insist on my position LACRALO is independent and sovereign. As you said in his (evil, for me) the interpretation, LACRALO can give rules s and changes in it, so it is shown fully independent, not answerable to anyone. This phrase is clear: "This Memorandum of Understanding ("MOU") defines an agreement between the signatory organizations and the Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers. Its intention is to establish and define the activities to be carried out, the Latin American and Caribbean Regional At-Large great organization, supported by ICANN. " ICANN is another organization as shown in the previous paragraph. To that reason we have a memorandum of understanding, because there are two organizations connected with this type of contract or agreement. ICANN is based on California law, that is true, but this only affects the relationship with LACRALO if LACRALO against taking any the directive body of law (California law). if not, memorandum of understanding between two different organizations is still alive in strength. LACRALO consists of organizations and the governing body is GA, which is a delegate for each organization. This is the explanation of "The signing of the organizations" sentence. Now LACRALO with the support of ICANN, as the memorandum of understanding, but this may change in the future, and could remain LACRALO a independent, and most importantly, this was the idea. The idea from the beginning was to have an independent organization in Latin America region made by end users, which was the LACRALO motivation.We are not part of ICANN, which could be the meaning of that? ICANN multistackeholder model and there is no need for uniformity. And to build a democratic and diverse ecosystem of ICANN needs OPINION different to the different focus groups. LACRALO is one of them, consisting of end-user organizations in the region of LAC. ICANN needs an independent and Sovereign LACRALO. My personal opinion about it.

A big hug, big and strong for you.

Carlos Dionisio Aguirre NCA GNSO Council - ICANN former member of ALAC for LACRALO Lawyer - Specialist Business Law Sarmiento 71 - 4th. 18 Cordoba - Argentina - * 54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423 http://ar.ageiadensi.org

From: carlton.samuels @ gmail.com Date: Monday, August 13, 2012 12:41:48 -0500 Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-en] RES: OP To: carlosaguirre62@hotmail.com CC: lac-discuss-en@atlarge-lists.icann.org

08/10/2012 Carlos Dionisio Aguirre <carlosaguirre62@hotmail.com>

: The government that you mention does not apply in this case, because we a specific standard. n the other side I LACRALO is not part of ICNN only we have a Memorandum of Understanding signed, but are independent standards of ICNN.

Regards

================================

My brother Carlos: See the highlighted portion of text, according to the translation. In this case, I think the interpretation is incorrect.

LACRALO its interpretation that is "independent" of the ICANN standards is widely held in Latin America. Without doubt, I think is responsible for statements such as "LACRALO is sovereign. "

Now, lawyers can and do disagree on the interpretation of the law or documents. The case law confirms this. Add to this and in this context, differences in the stories and legal mechanisms interpretation of the so-called 'common law' countries and countries 'Civil right' Front predominantly Latin American Caribbean. This is a perfect example and such other case.

ICANN premise is well defined in the law. It exists as a 'Public benefit' corporation under the laws of the State of California. When registering as a legal entity, it filed its application with the texts State.These bye-laws submitted and accepted by the State of California unites and strengthens its operations and actions.

This means that the actions of ICANN are legal and enforceable only in the as to comply with its implementing legislation.

LACRALO premise is defined by the Memorandum of Understanding signed with the MOU ICANN.Ese subject to the ICANN bylaws, ICANN can not make binding agreements are detrimental to its implementing legislation.

This is the text describing the "Purpose and Scope application "of LACRALO in Memorandum of Understanding signed with ICANN:

"This Memorandum of Understanding (" MOU ") defines a agreement between the The signing of the organizations and the Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers.Its purpose is to establish and define the activities carried out for Latin America and the Caribbean Regional At-Large great organization, and supported by ICANN. "

Note the word * "Organizations signing" *.

Here is the definition of that "The signing of the Organizations ":" Organizations of the Latin America and the Caribbean, certified by the ALAC and At-Large Structures that are signatories to this MOU. ".

This is the signature * organizations *, ie, ALS, which enjoy the legal relationship with ICANN. In other words, is purely an LACRALO tag for ease reference, which means "all of us, ALS, acting together ".

The ALS certification requirement represents another obstáculo.La power accept and certify ALS is transferred to the ALAC through texts implementation of ICANN. In other words, * not * LACRALO can not exist absent a text of application of the ICANN mandate of the action of the ALAC.

The MOU states clearly the commitments sets, ** jointly and severally, the parties to it.

The Memorandum of Understanding, signed, joins ICANN to six (6) the commitments to LACRALO **. In turn, labeling LACRALO ALS, ie those who signed the Memorandum of Understanding joins us, * and * jointly alone, five (5) shares different, with ICANN in the pursuit of our joint commitments.

The truth is that there is a gulf of difference between America in general America and the Caribbean to understand the meaning of the "Sovereign" of the word in context.

In 2006, we invited and had legal interventions ICANN staff to explain this. I'm on the record several times, trying aligning the facts with general knowledge. My last time was in Costa Rica. I was responding to the contents of a document filed with the Secretariat and Assembly General.Y comments to my problems, I was condemned as a lying in several places. The recordings and transcripts are available for those wishing to learn more.

Records show Sooknanan Cintra, a lawyer, has also indicated the misuse of the word. Also, Lance Hinds and King of Roosevelt.

...

A partir de mi lectura de sus escritos e intervenciones, creo que Fátima Cambronera entiende muy bien las diferencias.

do context of the names and numbers of the promotion policy, counseling and development is informed and limited by the MOU signing, which in turn is subject to powers and the extent granted by the ICANN bylaws and Regulations LACRALO Procedure.

LACRALO may, if it so chooses, to change its rules. The process for it is described in the Regulations. And even if there was a movement to change rules of procedure, you must follow the process as defined in the rules. The lawyers and the courts have a Latin term, "ultra vires "to describe the actions contrary to the rules.

Here's the attraction. LACRALO can not change the texts of implementation of ICANN.And so any rule change that affects or filth of ICANN texts application would make a LACRALO rogue and outside the parameters provided by the ICANN Memorandum of Understanding.

If this happens, any signatory of the Memorandum of Understanding, that is, any commonwealth, has standing and a duty of care complaint petition in this regard. And ICANN has a duty to respond and act as the Memorandum of Understanding and application text requires so to do.

Best, - Carlton ==============================

Carlton Samuels A Mobile: 876-818-1799 Strategy, Planning, Government, Evaluation and deadlines =============================

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